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I remember Carter's Army

So does John, and Dusty, and Frank, and so do a bunch of other Denizens and commenters.

We could probably scare the rest of you for hours with tales of how over 50% of our equipment was deadlined because there was no money in the budget for parts, maybe 30% of the remainder was parked in the Motor Pool because there was no money in the budget to pay for fuel for them, but it didn't matter much that we couldn't drive them to the training areas, because there was no money in the budget to pay for training ammo.

We used to joke that we were so hollow, we wouldn't even be able to whip Monaco in a fight -- and most of the time, we weren't joking.

A reporter interviewing the commander of NATO's land forces asked him what equipment the Sovs would need to reach the English Channel if they decided to crash through Fulda, and he answered, "Shoes."

Carter's military, not just Carter's Army, was hollower than the Keebler elves' tree, and we all knew it. It still amazes me is that enough of us were yet willing to fight World War III if it happened...

With SecDef and the Chairman of the JCS both apparently on board with Gates' proposed $400billion cut in the defense budget (which is closer to $900billion under the TROTUS/Reid plan), a lot of us old guys are having déjà vu all over again, but with more ominous overtones.

J.D. Pendry, over at J.D.'s Bunker, remember's Carter's Army, too, and expounds on it a bit more -- including why that sense of "here we go again" has such an ominous overtone for those of us whose long-term memory is as yet unaffected.

A quick read, and a scary one, because the similarities between Carter and Obama aren't limited to a dislike of the military and a skewed view of the Middle East...

22 Comments

 Heh.  We'll know the circle has fully turned when the black boot comes back, and Sergeants Major are more concerned about being able to pick their teeth while admiring their reflection and platoon MTEP evaluations are conducted using Blue Force Tracker displays in the vehicles while sitting in the motor pool running off of power-inverters plugged into the wall, vice vehicle power.  Unless they get that solar-panel operated combat vehicle built, of course.

The really creative units will use unit funds to buy RC paintball tanks and conduct the tank gunnery tables doing that.
 
 Pondering further, I am reminded the the Auld Soldier's tales of using aiming circles to align vehicle bumpers in the motor pool, with the vehicles being moved by muscle power, since 1/4 of them didn't have engines (the budget was such that you sent your engine in for a rebuild and got that engine back when it was rebuilt.  No swapping out for another engine while that one went in the queue.)  And the practical result of that when the Division was called out to head to Florida during the Cuban Missile Crisis, there was a string of dead vehicles along the route of march - less that 50% of the force made it with their original march serials.

And then there's the Auld Auld Soldier's experience involving creating an Army from virtual scratch in 1917...
 
These budgets cuts will not only put downward pressure on the quality and quantity of materiel but on the quality and quantity of personnel, also.  That's an even greater danger, IMHO.
 
John,

Gotta pay for Obamacare some way doncha know? After all it's not like national defense is mandated in the Constitution or anything.

I think I'll go to bed now - wake me in 2013.
 
NevadaSteve, don't go to sleep .... your participation and vote will be needed in 2012!   The situation won't magically change itself.

I think the Dems would LOVE it if we all kept snoozing, and dreaming of hope and change, as most did in 2008.
 
I joined the Navy in 1977 under Pres. Carter.  Ten "fam fire" bullets per each of my enlisted per year so they could defend our remote site if our very sensitive door alarms went off until the Marines arrived. I issued ammo to hunters only.  My husband's ship was about 60% manned, aircraft parts were swapped to the deploying units, leaving 'hanger queens' behind.  Today?  My son is on a ship built in the 1960s.  They 'saved' money a few years back by teaching maintainers by computers instead of training them on mock ups.  They are back to hands on training because the computer trained don't know how to fix their gear.  Now, they are cutting his rate by about 1/3.  The recent cuts have been deep.  Navy Times just had the new retirement pay proposal, affecting ALL on active duty. So far, it is just a proposal.  With 10 years in, you get an approx 13.5% avg contribution from the govt. towards their Thrift Savings Plan (TSP) Acct (retirement fund). This is variable based on deployments, ardous duty, etc. Plus, if staying to 20 years, military retirees would get 25% of base pay as a pension.  Currently, retirees at 20 years get 50% base pay.  Those with 15 years in get about 37% if they stay to 20 plus their TSP, those with 5 years get less, I think it was 12.5% plus TSP, and those with less than 5 get TSP only.  The budget cuts are pitting pay and retirement costs against ops, maintenance and replacement systems and platforms.  Old platforms require quickly escalating maint and training costs to remain operational, along with many additional man hours.  "Good" thing we don't pay our military overtime, right? 
 

I remember Carter's Army.  On ARTEP at Graf in Fire For Effect instead of a Battery One the evaluator would select one howitzer to fire.  Ammunition was that short.  Then came Reagan!  New guns, new vehicles, lots of bullets, lots of fun.

 
My youngest brother was stationed at Elvis former kaserne as a Tanker during Carter's misrule. He came home on leave and we watched Patton on TV one evening and my father made a remark about the Tanks, and my brother said, "they could probably get spare parts too." They tried to get him to re-enlist and his reponse was simiar to what Bill said his response to Dick Chaney would be.

I started Warrant Officer Flight in '76 and noted an overall black attitude around Rucker at the time.
 
My housemate lived the Carter army. He was in the Berlin Brigade as an Intel guy, eavesdropping on phone calls and suchlike. Apparently the guys in Berlin were actually somewhat serious, compared to the rest of the forces. They were mostly just a tripwire, and expected to give a good account of themselves while dying. The housemate has spoken of having to keep his chemical gear with him at all times, even at home. (mask, atropine injector, usw. 
 
We will be a hollow force at best until Obama is thrown out by the voters, along with the congresscritters more eager to buy votes than to defend our nation.

Even if we throw the SOBs out, the new task will be Herculean in terms of slashing spending mercilessly, and that will undoubtedly trigger reality and interest rates will get back up to Carteresque levels (!2.5% mortgages anyone?).

Until the DEFICIT is eliminated, we will be able to do little to stabilize Defense.  Until the DEBT is eilminated we will still be able to do little to rebuild Defense.

Meanwhile the interest we pay to the Chinese for the use of their money is enough to pay for their military. 

Each of us can help, in a small way, by working on the campaigns of folks who will actually cut spending, and contribute to key races where campaign contributions can swing a race in the right direction.  The "Club for Growth" is a pretty good source of info on which races are important, and especially which are winnable.  I give to candidates they recommend and also their PAC so they can run ads for/against people when it can make a difference.

We owe it to our kids to try to minimize the amount they will owe for the execrable spending habits of the liberals for the last 50 year.  (That includes guilty folks from both parties!)
 
"They were mostly just a tripwire, and expected to give a good account of themselves while dying."

No doubt.  While C Btry 1/22 FA relieved C Btry, 94th FA (Berlin Bde) in Berlin, I drove the 1/22's S-3 to Munster/Bergen-Hohne. He was the OIC of their ARTEP evaluation team that year.  From my chats with them, hardly anyone in C/94 thought they'd survive long if the ballloon went up.

Interesting tidbits of trivia:

Unlike us and other USAREUR FA units, C/94's guns didn't have any spades to back up on. (Plus, they were all painted OD green with bright red tow pintles and hubs, and shined with baby oil for parades.) Because of their urban environment in Berlin, they carried these huge wooden chocks that they wedged under their tracks to reduce movement from recoil and stay laid.

Also, they had an 8-gun battery that they split into 2 separate 4-gun firing platoons, which would maneuver and conduct fires separately.  Most everyone else, AFAIK, had 6-gun batteries that usually moved together as one unit.
 
 What happens when the members of both parties look at this and yell, “They have got it, this is what I call common sense.” They can do it in many ways, the budget process or the lack of it, or the revenue process or lack of it. The big thing to discipline is all of their expectations.  
 
I enlisted in the early summer of '79. So, I caught what would have been the tail end of the Carter Disaster for the Army, Navy and Air Force.

In the Corps, it didn't end. By as late as '85, the Corps was having to cut rifle range ammo alotment in half, motor pools were filled with deadlined vehicles with no spare parts, guns with shotout tubes were common in the gun parks, guns with so much wear and no replacement parts were so common that gunbunnies tended to dig "fighting holes" to jump into just prior to lanyard yank incase the break block blew out, etc and so on.

On the sky side, the airframes in use were older than most of the pilots (A4 and F4).   I do not recall when the newer airframe (F18) started reaching the squadrons, but in Japan, it was still the old rough birds. And squadrons in  Japan were the primary for Korean defense. Cannabalizing parts from one airframe to keep another flying was common practice.

I've said this before in other threads on the same sort of topic, but here it is again, as an example:

I was filling a manpower gap in the battalion .50 plt in weps company in '85. We were tasked with becoming "vehicle born". Problem was, the jeeps were so worn and thin in the floorboards that they couldn't support a gun pedestle. So, we had to adapt.

The windshilds were removed. The .50 tripod was mounted to the hood of the jeep. The rear legs against the windshild pivot pins and the front leg bent downard and resting on the bumper. An engineering stake was layed across the leading edge of the hood to reinforce it. The whold thing was tied down with parachute cord. Twist sticks had to be fixed into the cord because the recoil would loosen them up. So, every hundred rounds or so, the driver would run around the front of the vehicle tighting the things down.

The gunner operated his weapon from a kneeling position on the front passenger seat.

It didn't get any better. It did get much worse under Clinton.


 
I was in the Carter Air Force in Germany.  Two squadrons of airplanes, one squadron of people to maintain them. Of course half or more were hangar queens waiting for parts. We couldn't get pencils, pens, and even paper for copiers. We had to go out on the economy to get copies of our orders. I'll never forget having the job of placing stickers on the paper towel dispensers in all our restrooms that said "Why take two when one will do."  Reagan was a breath of fresh air when he was elected!


 
Heh.

I spent the Carter Years in Air Training Command. Office furniture was what we used for pecking order symbolism...if you had a chair with arms and/or wheels on it, you were somebody.

I went to Hogs about the time Reagan was elected, when the tactical Air Force was rebuilding. TAC (this was before it was merged w/SAC to become ACC) was not only recovering from Vietnam but rebuilding as well...airframes, infrastructure, readiness, you name it. The architect was one Wilbur "Bill" Creech who, while rather, um, eccentric, was a brilliant organizer, manager and leader who made the MBA schools' management texts (really) based on how he turned around a hollow force.

When I left TAC, you started sweating if your unit Mission Ready rates dropped below 95%. We could be ready to launch a squadron of jets (24) literally anywhere in the world in 12 hours (and that was the MAXIMUM time allowed before brakes had to be released for takeoff). If I didn't hit the range at least threee times a week and go to Red Flag at least once a year I was not trying. World War III would have been ugly, but in retrospect, not nearly as ugly as we thought, given what we now know about the Warsaw Pact and how well prepared we were in the mid-80s. 

Alas, we have a burgeoning peer competitor whose military leadership is, and I'm not exaggerating here, based on what I read in their English-language papers, spoiling for a major fight...for three reasons: they own our economy, they understand our leader, and they see us re-hollowing out our military. What amazes me is how little is learned based on empirical evidence...

- Transmitting signals that you are unwilling to defend your interests only encourages your enemies.
- An elite that promotes and encourages a systematic and conscious denigration of a society's core values undermines the security of that society by eroding citizens' willingness to preserve it.
- 25% of the US population thinks socialism is superior to capitalism despite the obvious disparities between the two systems' living standards, to say nothing of the lack of liberty and coercion endemic in the former's confiscatory system.
- Spending more than you make leads to economic crisis.
- More government means an infantilized population, i.e., less self-reliance, less innovation, less courage and less freedom.

Behavior has consequences.
 
I fear that we will return to the days when funding was so tight that officers and SNCOs had to chip in out of their own pockets to go out into town to buy swabs, brooms, cleaning supplies and even $hit paper for the troops.

Too many politicians, starting with the president, are far more interested in getting reelected than they are in doing what is right for the country. They are more than willing to whack away at the defense budget to avoid cutting a single penny from the social programs.

There is a restless dragon out there, just beyond the horizon, that senses any weakness and is just waiting for the right opportunity to strike. Each time I hear another Democrat call for cutting the "waste" from defense to save this give away program or that one, I hear the dragon come a little closer.
 
When Robert A. Heinlein was gunnery officer of USS Roper, he was right disappointed that not only did he not have enough funds to exercise the men at the guns, but had barely enough just to keep the pieces clean and servicable.
 
Umm, I think that's "serviceable."  Sorry about that.
 
B.O.H.I.C.A.
 
I joined the Army in 1977 and as a HAWK Missile maintenance guy, had to learn the fine art of cannibalization just to be able to fix anything.
 
I had a platoon of 15 people - on a good day.  The working vehicles towed the dead ones to the field setup, then came back for the personnel.

I had the only working 100kw generator, and literally had to place guards on it, even though it was always behind a lot of concertina, being the SCIF generator, lest the G-3 folks slip in, yank our plug, and plug in their own van.

We hoarded paperclips, raided property disposal to clean out drawers for office supplies, paid for the troops' toilet paper, and celebrated when the barracks showers worked.

And now my nephew will have to tolerate something worse?  Sheesh.
 
 I got out in 1977, and went back in early 1980 (knew Regan was going to win and I wanted to kick some Iranian a$$) .  I still had to buy my own a$$ wipe for the first year or so as the stuff supply had in Berlin (didn't ask for it, wanted 82nd again) was one step above wood pulp.  I swear: you could still see pieces of the pulp in the grey stuff that passed for bum wipe in Berlin.