Comments for This one is for Dusty

This one is for Dusty

2009-10-16T21:19:17Z

What with all the nose-tweaking Bill and I (and others in other venues)have been giving the Air Force regarding the decision to give flight pay to UAV operators, and such, I figure he could use a little morale boost.

Comment from andy novitske on 2009-10-20

2009-10-20T18:15:05Z

I love these comical motivational posters. Please post more (especially with the military spin)!

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-20

2009-10-20T18:09:24Z

Mizz Cricket -- It's called "bait"...

Comment from Cricket on 2009-10-20

2009-10-20T15:41:45Z

Aren't we a bit early for the Sibling Rivalry? Or are these the preliminary rounds?

*settles in with popcorn*

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-19

2009-10-19T10:11:01Z

Not to mention our chicks are usually hotter than yours.

And given the choice between going for a ride in a helicopter and going for a ride in a "Follow Me" truck, which do the hot chicks *invariably* pick?

...send in teh AF and Naval Radiators.

Nasal Respirators. The proper term is Nasal Respirators.

Comment from John of Argghhh! on 2009-10-18

2009-10-18T15:39:44Z

Wheee! I lurve intramural sports!

Problem with Dusty snarking me is that I usually agree with what he says about the Army...

But we still hold ground better'n you guys do.

If all ya wanna do is break things - send in teh AF and Naval Radiators.

Comment from Oldloadr on 2009-10-18

2009-10-18T14:32:28Z

If you all had scored higher on the tests, you all could have been zoomies, too...
I think you all are just jealous of our scandalous per diem at red flag and championship golf courses. Not to mention our chicks are usually hotter than yours.

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-18

2009-10-18T12:54:38Z

Yeah, a Marine *would* like the Coast Guard's unofficial motto: "You have to go out -- you don't have to come back." On the flip side of the coin is that, if anything *does* go wrong, they can always wade to shore.

Marines identify strongly with that whole "wade to shore" deal, yanno...

Comment from Grimmy on 2009-10-18

2009-10-18T10:49:04Z

From this former Marine's perspective, all y'all other services are just big ol' budget soaking sponges. Except the Coast Guard. They're cool.

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-18

2009-10-18T09:15:37Z

As I mentioned, it ain't even *your* Air Force any more.

Not that I didn't think they couldn't possibly get more wussified -- it just amazed me they did it so *fast*...

I'll save the snark I had for missileers falling asleep in the silos with the launch codes in their hands for now, since I b'lieve John is next on your dance card...

Comment from Attila of Argghhh! on 2009-10-17

2009-10-18T04:03:46Z

By the way, re: the snide asides in the comments to this post; de we REALLLLLY wanna go there? Just sayin', since all the behavior noted therein has been mirrored, in spades, in the ~~Senile~~ Senior service...I just put a fresh clip in my snark sidearm and chambered a round. Ready to partay, ladies...

Comment from Attila on 2009-10-17

2009-10-18T00:14:58Z

The bumps on the nose are from either hamfisted A-10 kids or over-enthusiastic boomers. When a 3000psi refueling boom hits a Hog in midair it occasionally makes a dent.

Comment from Cricket on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T23:55:24Z

Virtual pay for virtual flight.

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T13:09:36Z

HL -- They do that because if a round penetrates the side of the aircraft, you'll be protected.

Note that small arms fire *never* penetrates the side of a C-130 or a C-17 in flight -- it comes up through the *floor*, from a direction that IBA doesn't cover (I *sit* on my vest during takeoff and landing in a C-130, then put it across my knees to use as a pillow).

Note also that the crewmembers keep their IBA hanging on hooks at the front of the cargo bay.

Note also that the pilots probably *aren't* wearing chicken plates.

Comment from Heartless Libertarian on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T12:55:19Z

I'm still trying to figure out why they make us wear body armor on flights in and ouf of BAF. If there's a BG with an SA-7 on the approach, it's not going to make much difference on way or the other.

I guess becaue it's "combat" for the AF.

I'd pay to see a member of the HASC or SASC ask the CSAF why they need UAV pilots to be officers, when the Army does just fine with SGTs flying the radio controlled airplanes, with a 1LT (who doesn't fly the UAVs) in charge of a whole platoon of the things.

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T12:13:49Z

HL -- You'll hear the screech fan out around the globe, meet at the opposite meridian, then rebound so you'll enjoy it a second time.

In Boz, we always knew when the end of the month arrived by the huge increase in traffic into Tuzla. The guest house at Eagle would be packed that night, and in the morning, all the visitors would blast off back to Germany and the UK.

Around here, the additional traffic is caused by O-6s knocking out their takeoff and landing requirements for flight pay continuation. This past spring, a C-17 showed up and made multiple low approaches -- we found out later there were six pilots on board, and they'd switch seats on downwind so everyone could log combat time.

Heeeeeeee -- the FOB pool was closed all summer, and I never noticed until I heard the griping in the DFAC. From the vehemence being voiced, you'd a-thunk that KBR had been caught waterboarding puppies....

Comment from Heartless Libertarian on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T11:08:36Z

I wonder how loud the howling is going to be when the AF figures out that a provision in the new defense budget prorates all the combat pay bennies, instead of giving you the whole month for one day spent in theater?

Comment from BillT on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T09:20:48Z

BTW, the teeth on the A-10 are uneven, too...

...it's private club things and tends to jealously guard them from the non pilots, like leather jackets, flight suits even if you haven't been in a plane for a decade and won't ever get back in one except as a passenger...

One of the benefits of living in "Animal House" is that us inmates talk a lot after work (and working hours vary wildly), so we get to see many sides of the same situation -- the Big Picture becomes the Big Sculpture.

Did you know that missileers were issued flight suits and leather jackets? Yup. The AF did that just to keep people who *volunteered* to go sit 12-hour shifts in missile silos from complaining about how tough their job was -- and they got to wear them at briefings and in the Club, so they could impress the chicks.

Did you know that the Air Force insists that only rated pilots are capable of flying UAVs, but everybody else with UAVs teaches E-5s how to fly them? When the E-5 gets promoted to E-6, he commands the UAV Section -- the AF plugs a *colonel* into that slot.

Did you know that a couple of AF UAV controllers have already put in disability claims with the VA for PTSD? One claims he was overcome with grief when his birdie pranged into a mountainside and another one dropped a Hellfire on some terrs and claims he was traumatized by the sight of body parts flying through the air.

I just finished "counselling" an AF E-7 who was telling his troops they needed to write their Congresscritters that they were all in imminent danger because there were no F-16s on base available for Close Air Support -- as a pair of KWs armed with .50 cals and Hellfires were circling overhead and a pair of Apaches from down the road were flying into the FARP for fuel.

This ain't Your Father's Air Force. This ain't even *Dusty's* Air Force...

Comment from Oldloadr on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T07:42:31Z

I guess I'm too literal; I saw the picture and read the blurb from John and thought the reference to the UAV pilots was an aside and not the real story of this thread...

Anyway, you all are right, they shouldn't call it flight pay. USAF is paying the enlisted sensor operators (who sit next to the pilots) a huge incentive to stay in the career field (this due to the "enlightened decision" to make Creach AFB (formerly Indian Springs) the main stateside operating base of the UAV program, or you might get lucky and get assigned to Cannon AFB, NM; another "choice" assignment. I spent 7 years, 10 months and 23 days at Cannon. So, in an all-volunteer military the AF picks to 2 worse bases to man for the UAVs and then can't figure out why neither officers nor enlisteds are begging to get into the program. This is added to the aforementioned bait and switch the AF pulled on the new pilots...

Comment from SangerM on 2009-10-17

2009-10-17T06:07:22Z

I saw the dents. Really. I just figured it was war usage or training stuff or stray ducks or somesuch. I also saw the canopy up, and thought it'd been a better picture with that 'shopped out of there.

See, Neffi's not the only one.

Comment from John of Argghhh! on 2009-10-16

2009-10-17T03:27:32Z

Neffi! Get on target! Yer strayin' dude. Apparently no one else is lookin' at da pic!

Comment from Neffi on 2009-10-16

2009-10-17T01:08:00Z

ummmm.... looks like the nose hatch release mechanism on the that A-10 needs adjustment, judging by the 'field expedient' dents...

Comment from SangerM on 2009-10-16

2009-10-17T00:54:35Z

So here's my question: Why should people who sit on the ground get "flight pay" instead of some kind of specialty pay? I was a linguist. I didn't get extra pay until I got in a helicopter. The linguists on the ground participated in the same network I was in (it was a mixed air-ground sensor network consisting of heliborne and ground based systems). Should the ground based linguists get flight pay because the were using airborne sensors?

I think that's a crock o' garbage. Flight pay should be for actually getting in something that might crash. The pay is for the danger of flight, not for flying the plane. I can fly planes all day long from my desk at home, and would be ashamed to ask for flight pay for that. USAF is making a big mistake, especially when it starts talking about changing laws to pay ground-based sensor operators. Will the Army people who control airborne sensors in Guardrail get paid flight pay? I'd bet not.

Paying people for flying when they are not leaving the ground is big mistake, and should not be implemented. It is a lie, but of course, the people getting paid aren't going to complain, right?

It's called integrity! They need to get some.

Comment from FredGeorge on 2009-10-16

2009-10-17T00:37:21Z

Halo? I'm in!

And if you really think that's odd, give some thought to the premise of Ender's Game, which is without question among the finest SF stories of its genre....

And we could give specialty pay for cyberwarfare too.

I think the reason for the flight pay for the UAS pilots is that regular pilots get it and this past year the AF forced a number of recent officer pilot graduates to go the UAS route instead of letting go into the real airplanes like they'd signed up for. The flight pay is an offset prize for having spent the time and effort learning to fly, then getting screwed by the service on the back end, as I've heard some put it.

Of course all the UAS divertees were promised equal consideration for assignments, promotions, etc., but I dont think it will happen. The Air Force likes it's private club things and tends to jealously guard them from the non pilots, like leather jackets, flight suits even if you haven't been in a plane for a decade and won't ever get back in one except as a passenger, a guarenteed job after retirement if one of your friends is on the selection committee, irregardless of your qualfiications (the 'No Colonel Left Behind' program), no requirement to actually lead airmen until you've made O-4 (except for the few unlucky O-3 non-aviators) who cant avoid it, and the right to call yourself a combat pilot on your CV even if you were the O-6 unit commander and only flew about 100 hours somewhere inside the 'box' for some small amount of time, even if you were not ever shot at or in any real danger

So flight pay is like soma for those who had to trade a real plane for a joystick

Kind of like Obama's nobel peace prize I guess...

Comment from allen tanner on 2009-10-16

2009-10-16T22:58:01Z

flight pay for UAV drivers? seriously?

what's next...combat pay for playing HALO?