Moderator: McQ of Q&O and Blackfive; Pete Hegseth of Vets for Freedom, Genevieve Chase of American Women Veterans, Mark Seavey from the American Legion--Assistant Director of Legislation, Matt Bernard of A Soldier's Life
Matt: I'm here because on Wednesday a little woman named Patti Bader said I should be here. And when Patti tells you to do something, you do it. Injured twice and was returned to New Hampshire with shrapnel still oozing from my body, and no one knew what to do. Was told I'd be given a treatment plan, but no one contacted me. After three months, went to New Hampshire NG Sergeant Major with a powerpoint presentation about the failure to support their returning troops. It's now a hub where a soldier comes to central office and NCOs guide them to the resources available.
Genevieve: Goal with American Women Veterans is to raise awareness; still refining vision/mission. We want to raise awareness of women in service today, carrying the tradition of those who came before us. Lack of media coverage, spokespeople turned down if they didn't experience sexual trauma/rape in the military. Not every woman's experience is a true testament to what we've done. We also want to guide/mentor younger soldiers to help them confidently transition to civilian world where they do not underestimate themselves, where they feel confident in their business worth.
Pete: Was surprised to see that earlier topics covered "Are milblogs relevant?" We could not have done what we've done the last two years without Milblogs. They lent their time, space, credibility. That put together is just as powerful or moreso than a newspaper that's going bankrupt. VFF focuses on the mission side of things--perception of veterans is what we pay the most attention to. Other Veterans Service Organizations focus on benefits, etc. We focus on what is happening on the battlefield and getting spokespeople who can speak to that. MSM still wants to paint veterans as damaged goods coming home, so we are working on that, trying to shape the image. The big struggle is being given the time and material to win wars, struggle of this generation. [Mentions the DHS report, the Penn State training film, Hollywood movies.] We have to fight that perception on a daily basis. Obama rarely talks about victory, honor, strength. Instead it's about helping, aiding, taking care of veterans. This is good, but it is a view that looks at them only as needy/victims. Groups that only talk about benefits and health issues are important, but they reinforce the idea that they are victims, damaged goods, short fuse, etc.
McQ: We can talk back, an entirely different world than we had before. We need to hammer this home every day; zero tolerance for anti-veteran.
Mark: National Security and Foreign Relations lobbyist. I stay out of the VA side as far as lobbying because for some reason the Democrats don't like me. Democrats are generally better on VA funding issues, though. I was a college wrestler and got my ass whooped all over the place, but you don't hurt as much when you win. It's important that we set metrics on what winning is going to look like in Afghanistan; big fear is whether or not American people have the will to persevere. You cannot separate the war and the warrior--you need to support the guys AND what they're doing. With Vietnam, Hollywood was able to drive the vision of returning veterans--like Rambo. Earnings and unemployment and every other metric, VN veterans did better than non-veterans, but you wouldn't know it. It's improtant that we set the tone by speaking out. I was one of the founders of VFF: most important thing is getting the real voices of the guys on the ground out there, good and bad so that we define ourselves rather than being defined by others.
The DHS report cites other reports that are inaccurate/incomplete. Numbers are completely skewed/bogus. We're getting fed the report in 2-minute sound bites, but nobody is reading it. It talks about the vet as victim. Subheading--"The Disgruntled Military Veteran." On the VA side of things, Obama has done was "wonderful" things so far; VA budget is extraordinarily high. Seamless Transition is a step in the right direction, but then there was the private insurance debacle. We're going to see a lot of that kind of thing--weird suggestions, games with numbers, backtracks, etc.
McQ - Question from a reader: As a veteran, I think there needs to be a major change in the social climate of the military toward mental health. There is a cultural fear of dealing with mental health because it affects your clearance.
Matt - I'm a grunt, and among other grunts you want to try and be the alpha male. Perception is Alpha with PTSD is weak. They'll try to deal with it on their own. I tried that, took a few years before I stepped into a counselor's office. I'll have PTSD until my last breath, but it doesn't affect my life to the point that I'm sitting in a dark room drinking and feeling sorry for myself. It's a matter of getting the right tools, and now I can recognize soldier who I sense is having a hard time and help him out. If you don't know how to help yourself, you can't help your soldier. It's empowering to be able to help yourself.
Genevieve - Perception is reality in the military. We (NCOs) take better care of ourselves than our soldiers. Sometimes I have to say, "If I were my solider, how would I treat myself? What would I tell myself?" You have to be taking care of yourself to take care of others.
Attendee Bouhammer - There's a difference between PTS and PTSD. Anyone will suffer from PTS. Question is, is it a disorder? But they can't say it without that last letter. I still suffer from bad feelings, but it's not a disorder, doesn't affect my ability to function, but I have classic PTSD according to the book. Media uses PTSD/suicide and OK City bombing to characterize veterans. You're a vet, you have PTSD; No, I'm a veteran and I've had a bad experience just like anyone else. I have soldiers with PTSD and they will never be the same, but the vast majorities are fine and they will always have strong emotions about their experiences.
Mark - PTSD is a problem for us. There are literally not enough people in the country to get enough mental health people for returning veterans. Everyone agrees we need more, but public perception is that everyone coming back has it. Starts to stigmatize hiring a veteran, taking their honor, etc. In National Guard, like my situation, the guys were still there to help each other out and that was a huge benefit to get them to acknowledge and de-stigmatize the problem among those who had PTSD.
Matt - Recently two army generals admitted they had PTSD--said "I am still a leader, still doing my job, still functional. I can deal with it, and you can too." You can deal with it, you just have to get the proper tools.
Pete - We need to do everything we can to help guys who need it, but we don't need a public service announcement about PTSD--who is that targeting? I think we shouldn't be "scaring the public with PSAs." Well-intended, but it did the wrong thing.
Geneveive - That PSA showing soldier all alone and then being welcomed home spoke to me. That was my experience since I was a reservist and we lived all over the place. Had a friend interested in joining military as a mental health expert--pay for schooling and then join for a certain amount of time. As far as she knows, there is no such program. We have to educate employers about why they should hire veterans, and how whether that veteran has PTS/PTSD does or doesn't impact their performance--if they're functional they are going to be good e mployees.When America calls its troops up, the repercussions last for a long time. "We're invested in this war, America isn't." [ Sees it as better to raise the issues even if it isn't perfect because the alternative is ignoring it.]
[Pete - Emphasizing that the need/issues is real, but disagrees with the methods.]
Journalist attendee - Of the Vietnam generation. Myth of crazy VN veteran was created by media. As a journalist I am extremely interested in the problem of PTSD, but how do we address it without permanently stigmatizing the soldier? There are issues of army mishandling PTSD, etc. How do we draw attention to the issue without stigmatizing them?
Mark: DHS report--McVeigh is always used against us, but his work as a soldier had nothing to do with what he did in Oklahoma, completely unrelated. NY Times report about veterans and violence did more damage than anything else could've done in years. Those of you with PTSD, go out and tell your stories so that people understand what it really is, that you're not crazy with violence.
Matt: We don't need awareness, we need solutions. Not people who talk, but people who can help.
Genevieve: Mentions communityofveterans.org, "Facebook for vets," private forum with peer-to-peer interactions. PTSD groups that have been most successful are being led by VN veterans. We need to develop peer-to-peer networking and connections between older and younger soldiers. Maybe reclass older soldiers as mental health workers.
Mark: VA asked for 32 billion more in the budget and the congressional committee chair asked how they needed more than they said six months ago. Turns out they were using actuarial figures from 2000, before the wars started to predict their budget needs. VA has always been so far behind. It's not that the service from the VA is bad (higher approval rating than civilian doctors), problem is getting in the door (delay). It's a trainwreck. Hopefully the "astronomical" budget for this year will fix it.
Active Duty Marine Attendee: "Amen, brother" to Pete's statements. Disagree with climate concerns regarding getting help. Data vs. anecdotal. Blogosphere can contribute to the anecdotal problems. By attempting to raise awareness, is blogosphere helping or making it worse?
Pete: Highlighting positive stories about people who have served helps counter it. Stories in MSM are spun on an anecdote without data that shows this isn't the norm.
Matt: People say they're fine in checkout so that they can home. So, trusting statistics can be misleading.
Attendee: As a navy spouse, I've heard zero about PTSD, but as a columnist and talkshow host focusing on family support I hear about Navy spouses who are blindsided by this. It's a family issue.
Matt: It does start with family support channel--spouse is first line of defense. They're gonna be there to see when things start to go wrong (early signs). They need to be educated to recognize the issue.
Attendee: I'm a civilian. How can we civilians help?
Mark: Educating the public is a Sisyphean task. Most of time not interested, and when they are they get it wrong. But that doesn't abrogate our responsibility to do just that. It's important that we reach out. For some of us, our only family is the guys we served with and we communicate all the time--as my family they can also serve the function of recognizing the problems.
Matt: I'm here because on Wednesday a little woman named Patti Bader said I should be here. And when Patti tells you to do something, you do it. Injured twice and was returned to New Hampshire with shrapnel still oozing from my body, and no one knew what to do. Was told I'd be given a treatment plan, but no one contacted me. After three months, went to New Hampshire NG Sergeant Major with a powerpoint presentation about the failure to support their returning troops. It's now a hub where a soldier comes to central office and NCOs guide them to the resources available.
Genevieve: Goal with American Women Veterans is to raise awareness; still refining vision/mission. We want to raise awareness of women in service today, carrying the tradition of those who came before us. Lack of media coverage, spokespeople turned down if they didn't experience sexual trauma/rape in the military. Not every woman's experience is a true testament to what we've done. We also want to guide/mentor younger soldiers to help them confidently transition to civilian world where they do not underestimate themselves, where they feel confident in their business worth.
Pete: Was surprised to see that earlier topics covered "Are milblogs relevant?" We could not have done what we've done the last two years without Milblogs. They lent their time, space, credibility. That put together is just as powerful or moreso than a newspaper that's going bankrupt. VFF focuses on the mission side of things--perception of veterans is what we pay the most attention to. Other Veterans Service Organizations focus on benefits, etc. We focus on what is happening on the battlefield and getting spokespeople who can speak to that. MSM still wants to paint veterans as damaged goods coming home, so we are working on that, trying to shape the image. The big struggle is being given the time and material to win wars, struggle of this generation. [Mentions the DHS report, the Penn State training film, Hollywood movies.] We have to fight that perception on a daily basis. Obama rarely talks about victory, honor, strength. Instead it's about helping, aiding, taking care of veterans. This is good, but it is a view that looks at them only as needy/victims. Groups that only talk about benefits and health issues are important, but they reinforce the idea that they are victims, damaged goods, short fuse, etc.
McQ: We can talk back, an entirely different world than we had before. We need to hammer this home every day; zero tolerance for anti-veteran.
Mark: National Security and Foreign Relations lobbyist. I stay out of the VA side as far as lobbying because for some reason the Democrats don't like me. Democrats are generally better on VA funding issues, though. I was a college wrestler and got my ass whooped all over the place, but you don't hurt as much when you win. It's important that we set metrics on what winning is going to look like in Afghanistan; big fear is whether or not American people have the will to persevere. You cannot separate the war and the warrior--you need to support the guys AND what they're doing. With Vietnam, Hollywood was able to drive the vision of returning veterans--like Rambo. Earnings and unemployment and every other metric, VN veterans did better than non-veterans, but you wouldn't know it. It's improtant that we set the tone by speaking out. I was one of the founders of VFF: most important thing is getting the real voices of the guys on the ground out there, good and bad so that we define ourselves rather than being defined by others.
The DHS report cites other reports that are inaccurate/incomplete. Numbers are completely skewed/bogus. We're getting fed the report in 2-minute sound bites, but nobody is reading it. It talks about the vet as victim. Subheading--"The Disgruntled Military Veteran." On the VA side of things, Obama has done was "wonderful" things so far; VA budget is extraordinarily high. Seamless Transition is a step in the right direction, but then there was the private insurance debacle. We're going to see a lot of that kind of thing--weird suggestions, games with numbers, backtracks, etc.
McQ - Question from a reader: As a veteran, I think there needs to be a major change in the social climate of the military toward mental health. There is a cultural fear of dealing with mental health because it affects your clearance.
Matt - I'm a grunt, and among other grunts you want to try and be the alpha male. Perception is Alpha with PTSD is weak. They'll try to deal with it on their own. I tried that, took a few years before I stepped into a counselor's office. I'll have PTSD until my last breath, but it doesn't affect my life to the point that I'm sitting in a dark room drinking and feeling sorry for myself. It's a matter of getting the right tools, and now I can recognize soldier who I sense is having a hard time and help him out. If you don't know how to help yourself, you can't help your soldier. It's empowering to be able to help yourself.
Genevieve - Perception is reality in the military. We (NCOs) take better care of ourselves than our soldiers. Sometimes I have to say, "If I were my solider, how would I treat myself? What would I tell myself?" You have to be taking care of yourself to take care of others.
Attendee Bouhammer - There's a difference between PTS and PTSD. Anyone will suffer from PTS. Question is, is it a disorder? But they can't say it without that last letter. I still suffer from bad feelings, but it's not a disorder, doesn't affect my ability to function, but I have classic PTSD according to the book. Media uses PTSD/suicide and OK City bombing to characterize veterans. You're a vet, you have PTSD; No, I'm a veteran and I've had a bad experience just like anyone else. I have soldiers with PTSD and they will never be the same, but the vast majorities are fine and they will always have strong emotions about their experiences.
Mark - PTSD is a problem for us. There are literally not enough people in the country to get enough mental health people for returning veterans. Everyone agrees we need more, but public perception is that everyone coming back has it. Starts to stigmatize hiring a veteran, taking their honor, etc. In National Guard, like my situation, the guys were still there to help each other out and that was a huge benefit to get them to acknowledge and de-stigmatize the problem among those who had PTSD.
Matt - Recently two army generals admitted they had PTSD--said "I am still a leader, still doing my job, still functional. I can deal with it, and you can too." You can deal with it, you just have to get the proper tools.
Pete - We need to do everything we can to help guys who need it, but we don't need a public service announcement about PTSD--who is that targeting? I think we shouldn't be "scaring the public with PSAs." Well-intended, but it did the wrong thing.
Geneveive - That PSA showing soldier all alone and then being welcomed home spoke to me. That was my experience since I was a reservist and we lived all over the place. Had a friend interested in joining military as a mental health expert--pay for schooling and then join for a certain amount of time. As far as she knows, there is no such program. We have to educate employers about why they should hire veterans, and how whether that veteran has PTS/PTSD does or doesn't impact their performance--if they're functional they are going to be good e mployees.When America calls its troops up, the repercussions last for a long time. "We're invested in this war, America isn't." [ Sees it as better to raise the issues even if it isn't perfect because the alternative is ignoring it.]
[Pete - Emphasizing that the need/issues is real, but disagrees with the methods.]
Journalist attendee - Of the Vietnam generation. Myth of crazy VN veteran was created by media. As a journalist I am extremely interested in the problem of PTSD, but how do we address it without permanently stigmatizing the soldier? There are issues of army mishandling PTSD, etc. How do we draw attention to the issue without stigmatizing them?
Mark: DHS report--McVeigh is always used against us, but his work as a soldier had nothing to do with what he did in Oklahoma, completely unrelated. NY Times report about veterans and violence did more damage than anything else could've done in years. Those of you with PTSD, go out and tell your stories so that people understand what it really is, that you're not crazy with violence.
Matt: We don't need awareness, we need solutions. Not people who talk, but people who can help.
Genevieve: Mentions communityofveterans.org, "Facebook for vets," private forum with peer-to-peer interactions. PTSD groups that have been most successful are being led by VN veterans. We need to develop peer-to-peer networking and connections between older and younger soldiers. Maybe reclass older soldiers as mental health workers.
Mark: VA asked for 32 billion more in the budget and the congressional committee chair asked how they needed more than they said six months ago. Turns out they were using actuarial figures from 2000, before the wars started to predict their budget needs. VA has always been so far behind. It's not that the service from the VA is bad (higher approval rating than civilian doctors), problem is getting in the door (delay). It's a trainwreck. Hopefully the "astronomical" budget for this year will fix it.
Active Duty Marine Attendee: "Amen, brother" to Pete's statements. Disagree with climate concerns regarding getting help. Data vs. anecdotal. Blogosphere can contribute to the anecdotal problems. By attempting to raise awareness, is blogosphere helping or making it worse?
Pete: Highlighting positive stories about people who have served helps counter it. Stories in MSM are spun on an anecdote without data that shows this isn't the norm.
Matt: People say they're fine in checkout so that they can home. So, trusting statistics can be misleading.
Attendee: As a navy spouse, I've heard zero about PTSD, but as a columnist and talkshow host focusing on family support I hear about Navy spouses who are blindsided by this. It's a family issue.
Matt: It does start with family support channel--spouse is first line of defense. They're gonna be there to see when things start to go wrong (early signs). They need to be educated to recognize the issue.
Attendee: I'm a civilian. How can we civilians help?
Mark: Educating the public is a Sisyphean task. Most of time not interested, and when they are they get it wrong. But that doesn't abrogate our responsibility to do just that. It's important that we reach out. For some of us, our only family is the guys we served with and we communicate all the time--as my family they can also serve the function of recognizing the problems.
Actually, they are already working on it. The Cincinnati VA is starting a remote program designed to go out and find the veterans. A mobile admissions office, a medicalmobile, is now scheduled for every weekend from may through Christmas, going out to events within a 50-mile radius of Cincy every weekend. Fairs, Reds games, Bengals games, car shows etc, strictly to enroll vets. They come into the van, get signed up and quick physical, and when they leave, they are enrolled and have their first medical appointment. No more having to go sit at the VAMC just to get enrolled, then come back for their appointment. if it works out, there will be more across the country. And, I interviewed on Friday to be the Program Manager for getting the word out with the Cincy VAMC PA office. And I definitely plan on using the blogworld to get the word out, IF I get the position.
If you get the position, give me a shout and I'll help you get hooked up with the American Legion folks on the Indiana side within your AO. They'll jump on something like that.
Is this something unique to the Cincy VA?
dammit.......