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H&I Fires* 21 DEC 2008

Open post for those with something to share, updated through the day. New, complete posts come in below this one. Note: If trackbacking, please acknowledge this post in your post. That's only polite.
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This is why you "return your tray table to it's original, upright configuration and stow your carryon under the seat in front  of you, leaving the aisle clear"
"By the time the plane stopped we were burning pretty well and I think I could feel the heat even through the bulkhead and window," he wrote. "I made for the exit door as quickly as I could, fearing the right wing might explode from the fire. Once out, I scrambled down the wing."

The 107 passengers and five crew members made it out through slides, and firefighters put out blaze quickly, said airport spokesman Jeff Green.
A big "Well Done!" to cabin crew and passengers of Continental Flight 1404 in Denver yesterday.  I realize the flight crew may be deserving too, but since we don't know  what caused the incident yet, I'll hold back on that.  -the Armorer

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Yossarian is alive and well.  If you don't get the reference, your education has left you bereft.



Gad, I'm looking forward to the book.  -the Armorer

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Since I'm in a multi-media mood today...   btw, there is some naughty language.



Presented as a public service of Castle Argghhh! LLC.  H/t, Toluca Nole  -the Armorer

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There's some whinin' goin' on near Seattle.  Snerk.  I hadda scrape the ice off the window to check the thermometer around here.  2F in direct sunlight, with a 20-30 knot wind taking the wind chill into the -20/-23 region.  Frostbitten rooster combs look funny, though it doesn't seem to bother the rooster any.  They just crumble off and grow back.    -the Armorer

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*A term of art from the artillery. Harassment and Interdiction Fires. Back in the day, when you could just kill people and break things without a note from a lawyer, they were pre-planned, but to the enemy, random, fires at known gathering points, road junctions, Main Supply Routes, assembly areas, etc - to keep the bad guy nervous that the world around him might start exploding at any minute. Not really relevant to today's operating environment, right? But, it *is. The UAVs we fly over Afghanistan and Pakistan looking for targets of opportunity are a form of H&I fires, if you really want to parse it finely. We just have better sensors and fire control now. Of course, now I have to call them UAS's, because someone got a Legion of Merit for the name change.Anyway, I call the post H&I Fires because it's random things posted by me and people I've given posting privileges to that particular topic. Another term of art that might be appropriate is Free Fire Zone.

36 Comments

OMG - that was funny.  'Scuse me, while I go tell BT in person :-
 
Ever since an education with a few classes of aircraft failures and why they happen I've never been thrilled to sit in any tin can knowing I'm in the care of a cost cutting company.

However my education has indeed left me bereft.
 
Well, since you're Australian, we'll cut you a break, Argent.  Just as my education has left me bereft of much of what is considered fine Australian literature, you can get a pass on not having read a classic of American literature - Catch 22, by Joseph Heller.
 
 I hate high-speed rejects. I HATE high-speed rejects. If anything goes wrong, we're all passengers. Especially on a less-than-dry runway. That said, they probably got away with a lot less damage/injury than is the norm.

Did I say I hate high-speed rejects?
 
In helicopters, a high-speed reject is when the earth suddenly spits you fifty feet into the air.
 
All you yonguns have so many nice new airports with nice long runways, you miss out on winter landings at old Kansas City, Love Field, a shorter Midway, and a one runway shorter Newark in a cross wind. While there was little snow in San Diego, you can sit in a bar on top of one of those office buildings and be in the landing pattern. Oh and wave at the passengers.

There but for the grace of God...could have been me. Luck of the draw. Whew.
 
Second subject:

If you buy an egg for a dollar, sell it for 3, buy it back for 5, and sell it for 4...do you make a profit?

One of my favorite books. Had to use a pencil. Took, what? 100 pages to get to the complete equation.
 
You made a buck, the hard way.

Now my head hurts.
 
Good man that BillT.
 
Okay, I can do that math, but since we sell eggs 'round here, I can't imagine why I'd want to do it that way.

Of course, you don't have to buy chicken scratch or worry about chicken poop, either.

And that egg starts to look a lot like a fruit cake... in that it keeps changing hands alla time....
 
John,

I read the book 45 years ago, but it had something to do with free enterprise and good marketing. It started with the end and worked its way back to the beginning. The first set of facts you are given is that he bought for 5 and sold for 3 and made a profit. And...it took most of the book to give you all the facts. The theory actually made sense...once you understood his motivation.

And then there's Major Major Major Major...but you'll have to find out about him yourself.

I read the book in Japan watching the Nam thing build up in the mid sixties. Very scary.
 
About the only thing I remember about that book was the guy who kept getting shot down as practice for getting to Sweden somehow. I know there was some stuff about the guy selling everything that wasn't nailed down but it has to be a good 35 years since I read it. Now I have to see how cheap I can get it on Amazon to refresh my memory.

As for the Plaixco video.  "I just wanted to help the kids, it's possessed." I snorfled. (A new favorite word from Rachel Lucas)
 
We had a guy in the Joisey Guard named Major Weber. He was a Warrant, so we introduced him to the newby Ell-Tees as "Chief Warrant Officer Major Weber" and watch them go through the mental gyrations.

He transferred to the Kansas Guard, and I do b'lieve he's retired now, so he can get his mail addressed to CW4(Ret) Major Weber.
 
Australian's have been exposed to Catch 22 - I read it in high school, and then saw the film version once the censors had chopped it up enough to consider it safe for us young people.  If movies can make you a psychopath/rapist/whatever, what about the censors that watch them all uncut!
Frostbitten cock combs made we wince!  Here where it gets to 30 deg. F on a cold day, we have no concept of the affect of such cold on the world at large.  At least is it warming up a bit for Christmas and it was about 90 F yesterday!
 
John,

To follow up on yesterdays post and a Catch 22...I was TDY with the 4080th Strat Recon Wing out of Del Rio in 62 when the Col came busting into OPS brandishing the latest Time mag and shouting for the coordinates for some airfield in Cuber. We found the site and the appropriate film and sure enough there it was in all its Top Secret glory. To prove to the American public why we were going into blockade the people up in the Puzzle Palace released our photo to the MSM.

I thought it was real cool and voiced a desire to let my father know it was our photo. Of course the Col told me it would be stockade time and loss of security clearance if I did. The photo was still TS at our facility and even if it was published in Time, I was duty bound not to discuss it. You could very nicely see the MIG 21's parked on the tarmac.
 
Never got those SezaGeoff, we got things like February Dragon and Shakey.  To Kill a Mockingbird was an American one.  Now the kids pick their own books.  Not a bad idea in one sense but it'd be nice to encourage less trash.  I did a whole 1/4 a year of history during high school of one lesson a week.  I did precisely none in Engineering of course.  Apart from Australian explorers anything I know has been off my own back.
 
Fishmugger, you left taxes out of the equation.  LOL
 
My favorite line/notion from Catch-22, which was a GREAT book, was the deal with Major Major who would leave through the window of his office so he wouldn't have to talk to anyone, so that when he was out he was in and when he was in he was out, a line which I actually have some reason to use every now and again, though not in quite the same way....

Also. I believe the crash-lander was Orr, (who I think was the guy who had the professional Italian girlfriend who kicked him in the head with her heel?) He would practice with all the stuff in the life raft every time he crashed.

As for BT, that's just funny (and sad) as all hell--though I just have to believe the 1SG was more screwing with him than was really that stupid. I mean, really... a little? maybe?

Well, unless he was a tanker or an arty 1SG, in which case I might buy it. :-)

I was hauled into some Arty SGM's office on a Nuremberg kassern once because I had my BDU sleeves rolled the way the Marines wore them (the smart, sensible, NON-stupid way), and the SGM told me there was a reg that said I had to wear them the other way (the dumb, retarded, massively stupid Army way), and when I told him that there was no reg, no letter from CSM Horvath (1AD CSM), and that even the Commandant of the 1AD NCO Academy (SGM Kidd) had to let me wear them that way when I was not in formation, the Arty SGM made me come to his office and stand there at-ease while he dug through every binder on every shelf, pestered his clerk, and even made a call to 1AD HQ, etc. I was there about 45 minutes, and in the end, the best he could do was scold me for wasting his time instead of just turning my sleeves the 'right way,' at which time I pointed out that he never told me to do that and if he had, I would have done so immediately (being ordered to and all), and I would have left them that way for as long as it took me to get off his kassern, but all he ever did was tell me there was a reg, etc., and I disagreed. Of course, that just made him really angry and I heard about it when I got back to Katterbach, but hey, it made the day memorable. And for the record, I wore my sleeves the comfortable way for the rest of the time I was in Germany and for the two years I was at Ft. Hole after that. It is no exaggeration that having to take my shirt off to roll up my sleeves which were then very uncomfortable was among the top 15 reasons I left the Army after 14 years. No kidding.

BTW, the reason _everyone_ gave for me having to wear my sleeves the stupid way was supposedly so we could pull them down in a hurry in the event of an NBC attack. Duh...yeah, right. I always figured it was just some dumba$$ General who just didn't like the non-cammo inside showing and the NBC thing was more military sounding than Boss Nass don't like the way it looks.

Like I said, "When he's out he's in and when he's in he's out."


 
fdcol63...Taxes? Taxes? We're conducting a cash and carry business in a foreign country under a status of forces agreement where as home business conducted on property controlled by U.S. forces are not subject to local tax and the Feds would never find me. I think. Besides you've never seen one of my expense reports.
 
What was the music playing behind BT's sterling contribution?

Seriously. I don't get out much. 
 
steveH - That's the soundtrack from the last eleventybillion Army recruiting advertisements on TV.
 
Hmm how efficiently inefficient.  I suppose the reasons are usually about control and conformity.  Things I kind of hate actually but I suppose they do have their good side.
 
the reason _everyone_ gave for me having to wear my sleeves the stupid way was supposedly so we could pull them down in a hurry in the event of an NBC attack.

Actually, the real reason is so that in the event of enemy ground attack, they don't zero in on your lighter-colored sleeves. Or so I was told by an infantry guy.

Actually, the real reason is so that you can just yank your sleeves down before you hop into the helicopter cargo area without having to take your shirt off. Or so we told the cargo.

Actually, the real reason is so that...



 
..the real reason came out of the Air Assault community, so you could yank your sleeves down quickly in case of fire in the aircraft....

Heh.  The real reason was far more likely to be a cabal of Command Sergeants Major in the Airborne community.

That or the CSM at Fort Benjy.
 
Oh, and the subtitle for Sanger's autobiography up there could be... 

"Why I'm not a Sergeant Major."

/verbose


 
It is the Milo Minderbinders of the military that keep things moving and troops fed.

For the furrin devel what aint had the privilege of reading Catch-22, here's the catch:

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Yossarian: Is Orr crazy?
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: Of course he is. He has to be crazy to keep flying after all his close calls he's had.
Yossarian: Why can't you ground him?
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: I can, but first he has to ask me.
Yossarian: That's all he's gotta do to be grounded?
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: That's all.
Yossarian: Then you can ground him?
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: No. Then I cannot ground him.
Yossarian: Aah!
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: There's a CATCH?
Yossarian: A catch?
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: Sure. Catch-22. Anyone who wants to get out of combat isn't really crazy, so I can't ground him.
Yossarian: Ok, let me see if I've got this straight. In order to be grounded, I've got to be crazy. And I must be crazy to keep flying. But if I ask to be grounded, that means I'm not crazy anymore, and I have to keep flying.
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: You got it, that's Catch-22.
Yossarian: Whoo... That's some catch, that Catch-22.
Dr. 'Doc' Daneeka: It's the best there is.
 
I thought the real reason for the Army sleeve reg was so all those F*&^%!ING buttons would catch on the camo netting as you were putting it up in the field.
 
Frank - that's it!  You figured it out!  It wasn't the Airborne Sergeants Major - well, yes it was - but it was because *their* wives and girlfriends ran the off-post laundries where everybody got their patches sewn on and buttons replaced!

You sussed it!
 
I do remember when there were staffs and gunnies out and about making a fuss about Marines not having their sleeves done up in the "NBC Roll" silliness.

That lasted about a month.
 
Hmph.  I'm not even allowed to roll up my BDU sleeves in the first place, until Field Training this summer.

And after THAT, I suspect I may never wear them again, and it'll be ABUs from then on out.  Do ABU sleeves get rolled up?
 
"Oh, and the subtitle for Sanger's autobiography up there could be... "Why I'm not a Sergeant Major.""

LOL!

Too true, too true, though I coulda been, I'm pretty sure.  I was honor graduate at the 1AD NCO academy (after telling SGM Kidd on day one that I would be), and I had a really pretty decent EERWA, and was good on height and weight and PT and schools and awards, and I had already completed the MI OBC and MIAOC via correspondence, and had been a PSG since being an E5, had been selected for ANCOES at 13 years, and etc, etc...

However:  In '84 I put together a package to go to OCS, but because that was 11 years, I needed an exception to policy (the 10 years as an officer thing).  I put together the packet, had all the eyes crossed , and tees dotted, etc, and had some darn nice letters of recommendation, kudos and etc all the way up and down the line.  Then I went to see my acting Bn CO (the XO) who had to sign the thing.  He knew me very well, and after he signed it, he told me I should either just get out or go for WO, but that I should absolutely not go to OCS.  He said I would hate being an LT, that I would hate working for most O3 COs as an LT, and that I would almost certainly be miserable since I wasn't really the kind of person who was willing to put up with stupidity for the sake of a career.  Basically, he said I was too honest and too arrogant to be a good junior officer and that it would be misery for me and the people I had to work for.  It was a congenial conversation and he was a good man, so I thought about it, and it was during that weekend that I decided to leave the Army.  It was one of the best decisions I ever made.

As for the sleeves, the funny thing is that there was not a reg published that I was ever aware of, at least as late as 1987 when I ETS'd (there could have been one, but it was never produced by anyone I ever asked).  As far as I could tell, it was all just what people did because they were told they had to. 
 
*their* wives and girlfriends ran the off-post laundries where everybody got their patches sewn on and buttons replaced!

And got their BDUs starched.

Remember what CoS of the Army said when the BDUs first appeared? "No starch. This is a *Battle* uniform. Starching the BDU is prohibited." Yeah, that lasted about a month...

 
Hey, the Auld Soldier tells the story of the issuance of suede combat boots when he was a soldier, and young.  His sergeants told him they would be spit-shined by formation the next morning.

They were.  Fire was involved.
 
Heh. Between the comments and the stuff I've seen this week, I'll have a post tamarra.
 
Josh;

That explains it then.

We don't have TV.

Thanks. 
 
No problem.

And you're actually not missing much these days, there hasn't been any good TV to speak of in a few years...kinda like movies, although not quite as bad.