We're the Military and Airpower Guys of Jonah Goldberg of National Review Online + a stray we found wandering around looking lost. All original material JHD, BHD, JR, WT, and KA 2003-2010 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html Fri, 06 Jan 2012 18:28:05 Z Movable Type 4.12 en Copyright 2012 http://www.rssboard.org/rss-specification (which I did, yesterday)...and the supply nightmares associated with... what with the doom and gloom of Wolfwalker, Canoneer #4, Kevin, et.al., regarding the pending collapse of the Republic, and the fear by El Borak, Terry and others of the overall collapse of civilization, a fair number have expressed the desire to retreat to the Castle, break open the Arms Room, and fort up. Oddly enough, I'm not quite that down about things, but it never hurts to be prepared. There is a problem, however. The Castle Arsenal is not an Armory. It has many weapons, to be sure... but it... http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html Fri, 30 May 2008 10:47:18 -0600 Except maybe ry... Heh. I'm well known for being 'unconventional'. ]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73682 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73682 Sat, 31 May 2008 14:17:09 -0600 Geoff - I do, indeed, have a (T). Looking for the transit case and scope can, if any are laying about. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73677 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73677 Sat, 31 May 2008 09:47:47 -0600 steveH , Well, the problem with the 2-3 rounds per minute is that it never did happen. The "3 rounds per minute" but that historians keep talking about is a myth. It is based upon the bench trials conducted for the M1855 series under ideal conditions and with properly sized and prepared cartridges. There is also a world of difference between a smoothbore and a rifle regarding fouling issues. It's true that a soldier could, in all likelihood, get off 10 rounds or so at 2 rounds per minute when well trained. However, the fouling built up so fast that after the initial bundle of 10 rounds, loading became progressively more difficult. At Glendale and Gaines Mill, for example, there are numerous accounts of soldiers being unable to use their rifle muskets because of fouling issues, of men loading a round by pounding the rammer against a stone or tree, and letting fly with both cartridge and rammer. The US Army's solution was to adopt the William's Patent cleaner bullet. For those unfamiliar with it, it was a standard minie round with a zinc washer at the base through which passed a metal slightly cone-shaped rod. When fired, the rod was driven into the washer's center, which expanded the washer and scraped the barrel clean of fouling. It also kicked like a mule. One or sometimes two of these rounds were included in every packet of 10 paper cartridges. The Army's mistake was to wrap them in blue or green paper, rather than the ordinary colour paper and the men could easily distinguish them and toss them away. Some things never change L) Anyway, over the course of an engagement, although initial rate of fire may be higher, the average is 1 round per minute, or even less, dependant upon the conditions and the ability of the men to clear fouling. Respects, http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73676 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73676 Sat, 31 May 2008 08:54:39 -0600 Given that the AmmoMan.com doesn't seem to have any 303Br in stock, I better bring over a few bandoliers with rounds in stripper clips to the party! Will about 500 do? I can't remember if you have a N04 Mk1 T, but if you do I'll have that. I always used to tell my mates that if things went to hell, they could come here for a rifle and a bandolier, and bring me back more rifles and ammo after using the donations! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73674 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73674 Sat, 31 May 2008 07:25:26 -0600 I hope Springfield/Enfield users can do better than 1 aimed shot per minute; good troops could manage three shots/min with flintlock muskets a couple generations earlier, and the Minié ball made loading the later muskets faster. Even I could manage two/min with a flintlock, until I ran out of cartridges, and I'm old and shaky. (I was shaky before I got old, but still...) Even after fouling started to get in the way, two shots per minute ought to be doable with a Springfield type musket. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73669 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73669 Fri, 30 May 2008 23:24:48 -0600 BM-59, tanker model. Hands down my favorite 'long gun'. The Italians finally did something right besides pasta. Take a M1 Garand and add a magazine to it. Fantastic lil' weapon in 7.62. Easy to maintain, deadly accurate and comes to point in a second. Love my M1A1, but I'd chose the BM anyday. It's a joy to shoot and has the round to knockdown. None o' that sissified .22 stuff here, 7.62 IS stopping power. And, isn't that what we want? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73662 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73662 Fri, 30 May 2008 17:14:37 -0600 True enough - except that in the US, we've been inconsistent with that. Like fusilier and fusileer. We have had arsenals where we stored things, and armorys where we made things. And Castle Argghhh! is a manufactory. Well, more accurately (and legally, as we've paid no Special Occupation Tax as a manufacturer or gunsmith and do no work for others or original building from scratch), an assembly, finishing and rebuilding facility, including both firearms and ammunition. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73661 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73661 Fri, 30 May 2008 16:29:03 -0600 Arsenal= where you make them. Armoury= where you keep them. Sorta like the difference between clip and magazine. Cheers http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73658 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73658 Fri, 30 May 2008 16:10:08 -0600 ammoman.com baby! Free shipping!]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73652 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73652 Fri, 30 May 2008 13:25:06 -0600 ry, I'll help with the breastworks, moat, sniper hides, OP's, and other defensive positions. Building and placement of booby traps, clearing fields of fire, range cards, pre-positioned coordinates for H&I fires, and other errata. Just don't make me an officer. Grunt or any NCO position would be appreciated. Plus, I love to parachute...! Alan http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73651 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73651 Fri, 30 May 2008 12:58:08 -0600 still not enough cheetos in KS. And if we're all holing up at John's, I think we need a bigger goat. ]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73648 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73648 Fri, 30 May 2008 12:51:11 -0600 And ammo! Don't forget to BYOB! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73644 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73644 Fri, 30 May 2008 12:08:22 -0600 Fine ... I'll just bring my own shotguns and sidearms. :-P http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73643 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73643 Fri, 30 May 2008 12:06:31 -0600 I have a 1903-A3 Springfield, several .308 bolt actions, 2 AR-15's, a stainless Colt Commander, a commander size Para Ordnance in .45 ACP, .357 revolvers (5 r 6?), .32 ACP's, an SKS, numerous .22RF and .22WRF, MK4 Enfield in .303 British, hand & a half sword, calvary saber, katana, khukhri, multiple fixed blade knives, improvised explosives knowledge, .... Maybe I'll share...? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73642 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73642 Fri, 30 May 2008 11:43:25 -0600 I'll bring my own sidearm. But I'm a fair hand with a long rifle, failing that gimmie a mortar. I'll keep the neighborhood kids out of the yard ;) http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73641 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73641 Fri, 30 May 2008 11:14:59 -0600 That explains your upcoming rotator-cuff surgery then... all that back-patting. ;^ ) http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73639 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73639 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:57:08 -0600 Seeing the price of Wolf or Bernaul 7.62 x 39 nowadays, you can't imagine how often I pat myself on the back for stocking up with dozens of spam cans of it that I purchased during the late 90s. It's doubled in price since. I'm usually not that smart. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73637 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73637 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:50:47 -0600 Heh. You *coulda* had the crank-fired belt-fed M1919A1 in 7.62 NATO, with Ry as your AG, but noooooo, not now. Not after you commit the clip/magazine heresy! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73636 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73636 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:46:55 -0600 Randolph Scott.(Moment of silence) http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73635 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73635 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:45:50 -0600 Heh -- I admitted to playing hookey, didn't I??? Geez - are you going to make me take Ry's place in the dungeon? Hmmm ... Cheetos! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73634 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73634 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:44:42 -0600 Barb gets the matchlock. "Clip" indeed. Ha-RUMPH! If she abases herself properly, I *might* allow her to have the 3-round Berthier M1890 carbine. If she *really* abases herself properly, perhaps the Bethier M1916, with the 5 round, CLIP-fed magazine. But that's about it. Hey! I didn't get a ha-RUMPH outta that guy! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73632 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73632 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:34:21 -0600 Hmmm - I want the weapon with the largest capacity, of course :-) But since I've been playing hooky from class, the Armorer will have to edumacate me on the options in that area. Whatcha got that fires one of the 7.62 sizes and has a high-cap clip? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73631 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73631 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:31:12 -0600 With or without the magazine cut-off, Neffi? Terry - you get the Webley. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73630 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73630 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:21:41 -0600 No1 MkIII, please... SMLEs are *classy*, old boy. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73629 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73629 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:16:39 -0600 Ah, heck, I'll take the flintlock. I have a fair history of beating people with blunt objects. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73628 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73628 Fri, 30 May 2008 10:06:14 -0600 Knowing my own skill set, I may have to volunteer to pass the ammunition (and cook!!) rather then be on the front lines, if it's all the same to you. I used to be a good shot with a rifle, but that was years ago. I have no idea if my poor eye sight would now mean I can't hit the broad side of a barn, but it's not unlikely. I will do what my leaders tell me to do, including shoot at people/things. However, unless you just need cannon fodder in the shape of an old woman with a few good years left in her, I think I will not claim a weapon. I'll take what you give me and do what I am told. Will that work for you?? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73626 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73626 Fri, 30 May 2008 09:52:18 -0600 At least nobody will try to stick a *scope* on it. Except maybe ry... http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73625 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73625 Fri, 30 May 2008 09:47:49 -0600 This one (albeit an original, not a repro like the one in the link).]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73621 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73621 Fri, 30 May 2008 09:05:17 -0600 All of those are available, Jeff. However, you have to stand many feet to either side of me if you're going to shoot the noisy ones. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73620 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73620 Fri, 30 May 2008 09:01:13 -0600 I can't recall everything you have there, but I'll take either a Mosin-Nagant (91/30 or M44 preferably) or a Steyr M95 :D ! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73618 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73618 Fri, 30 May 2008 08:53:28 -0600 The M97 is spoken for. SWWBO has it. She's on the night shift? Need any 20 mike-mike? ]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73615 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73615 Fri, 30 May 2008 08:31:22 -0600 The "fluffy thing" appears to be a paper cartridge for either the .577 Enfield P-53/58 types, or mire likely a .58 for the M1855/61/63/63 et al series. Although, to be honest, the US Arsenals changed production in 1861 to a >57 caliber projectile, so as to serve both the Springfield and Enfield series weapons. Similarly, they went with a .53 caliber to as to serve both the US ,54 caliber series and the foreign .55 arms which were being imported in some quantity. For keeping heads down, the Springfield/Enfield weapons are pretty good. Although it takes around a minute to reload, it can still penetrate 6" of seasoned white pine at 1,000 yards :) Soft lead, unjacketed, slow velocity and high mass makes for quite an impression on the target. Easy to clean, too. Just hot water and rags and some sweet oil to wipe it down with before you put it to bed. respects, http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73609 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73609 Fri, 30 May 2008 07:16:08 -0600 ***Wildly raises his hand*** Me - me - me!!! I wanna Diddle Cricket aka .25ACP Webley. If it was good enough for K, in MIB, 'tis good enough for me. BTW - Love them 60mm Zero Charges.]]> http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73608 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73608 Fri, 30 May 2008 07:13:59 -0600 I'll take one of the modified flintlocks. I felt I could actually see the sights and target simu. with it because of it's length. Besides, I'm sloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo-breath-ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow on the trigger so a semi-auto or otherwise would be a waste of time. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73607 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73607 Fri, 30 May 2008 07:12:30 -0600 What's the fluffy thing at the front left? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73605 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2008/05/speaking_of_bul.html#comment-73605 Fri, 30 May 2008 07:04:08 -0600