We're the Military and Airpower Guys of Jonah Goldberg of National Review Online + a stray we found wandering around looking lost. All original material JHD, BHD, JR, WT, and KA 2003-2007 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html Tue, 23 Sep 2008 17:56:29 Z Movable Type 4.12 en Copyright 2008 http://www.rssboard.org/rss-specification If you haven't been following it - there's been a rambunctious, but mostly Rulez-following conversation in the comments to the 21 Mar H&I post. It amply demonstrates why I have the Rule about no gratuitous personal snarkage in serious conversations, and the ample range of thought and position among those who congregate here. Worth the trip downstream to read. And not because of *my* contribution - I just refereed. But, before you go down to do that, you should go over and read Bernard Lewis' 2007 Irving Kristol Lecture at the AEI website. Here's an excerpt to pique your interest:... http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html Fri, 23 Mar 2007 07:08:30 -0600 Guess this just petered out after starting with a firestorm... Hmmmm.... http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58243 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58243 Sat, 24 Mar 2007 09:12:45 -0600 Tea? *perk!* Aye lass, if'n I didn't like Loadr so much I'd have to run away with you to a far blue mountain for a good cup of strong black tea!!! err....uhm....anyway I've been doing a bunch of debates lately mostly at Stephens place (thats what happens your stuck at home 24/7 I guess) and I have stuff I want to interject on the 21st debate...but I'm afraid I'll say it wrong. I'll sort it out and try to put in my .02 sometime. Blog-Burn out maybe? I really need to go fishing. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58225 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58225 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:38:48 -0600 yeap he is the kettle that keeps the pot hot, tea anyone???? http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58224 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58224 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:15:45 -0600 Oh, now I want to call Oldloadr "Kettle" for some reason! Welcome, V2.0! An Irish Blonde - 'loadr you sly divil you! http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58223 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58223 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 10:06:34 -0600 I need to add my 2 cents worth on this “hot “ subject , 1st let me introduce myself I’m Oldloadr’s wife number 2, but in a past life I lived and worked in baghdad pre gulf war, coming from Ireland and the deep distrust of anything other than catholic teaching it was a breath of fresh air that we could all get along in a strange country, yes we had our moments of disagreements but were always able to share a beer at the end of the night , and while it was the birthplace of the Christian movement it was also steeped in history of multicultural facets. Being the gate way to both east and west, we were treated very well as western women, which didn’t happen in other Arab countries that I worked in. But, we were always aware that at any time we could find ourselves in jail should we cross the line , as happened to a few of my friends when they made the mistake of helping to gather information considered sensitive, We were allowed and encouraged to practice our respective religions, never were approached to convert which was the case in Saudi Arabia .The Iraqi people treated us with great respect and were very grateful for all we did for them , I was a nurse/midwife in a private hospital that Saddam set up so his people wouldn’t have to leave the country to get high class treatment but that was also a doubled edge sword as he didn’t want anyone in the western world to find out what he was up to , we were never naive enough not to realize this so we learned very quickly to look ,listen and say very little and that kept us below the security radar, We knew /saw a lot of things that were happening to the ordinary people that were inhumane , cruel and barbaric, but when I tried to tell people outside of the country I was dismissed as a “dumb Blond” even dumb blonds can see /hear and report as ordered !!!! My point is, it’s not the rank and file Iraqis that are the problem, but the corrupt politicians and foreign religious fanatics who are causing all of the problems. http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58218 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58218 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 09:55:23 -0600 To answer those who questioned or took exception to my comments: 1. What is an Islamist? I believe that an Islamist is a radical ideologue who truly believes he/she is doing the will of Allah by killing all who won’t convert, particularly Christians, or those from the part of the world known historically as Christendom. Of course, they only want to kill Jews, they have no interest in converting them (that goes back to a 3,000 year old sibling rivalry). How do I know this? Because they have said it themselves in their own propaganda. They have acted on these impulses and have argued among themselves on technique. Many Muslim scholars took exception with bin Laden for not giving the people in the WTC a chance to convert before cooking them to death. Although, I did not check the source where I got 10% of Muslims are radicalized, I accepted that based on my personal observations in the ME. That means whether we like it or not, the real inconvenient truth of our age is that 100 million people want to kill us if we don’t denounce our belief system and convert. See, that’s not complex, it’s simple. Now the smoke screen they put up (and that is all that it is) is that we are in the ME stealing their oil, that we support Israel’s right to exist, that we are not fair to the Palestinians (even though they themselves are not fair to them either). They bring up these points to confuse us and to sometimes inflame their followers, but the simple truth is our governments allow us to worship Jesus Christ (or not) and to drink alcohol and eat a ham sandwich. 2. I stand by my statement that all they understand is power. I could talk about the troubles in Fallujah for instance. The Army tried all of their “hearts and minds” tactics and all they got for it was dead GIs. The USMC finally got fed up and trashed the town and now it’s the safest (relative term) in Anbar. I could also mention my last active duty deployment to the ME. The USAF deployed 3 B-1B bombers to this base. Now for those of you who know anything about B-1’s, they don’t have to deploy and have launched air strikes from their CONUS bases. However, the idea was for the leadership of certain ME countries to “see” the power before they felt it. I think that is psychologically significant and nascent to my point. OK, I’m done now and thanks for the b’day wishes, everyone! See Maggie, I used spell-check… http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58216 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58216 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 09:48:15 -0600 John - Well I woke up this morning and saw that the thread of the 21st had a life of it's own. I will pontificate shortly on my one point that seemed to draw the most argument; i.e. All the Islamists understand is power. First, I must have another cup of coffee and contemplate these mysteries in context http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58207 http://www.thedonovan.com/archives/2007/03/the_struggle_wi.html#comment-58207 Fri, 23 Mar 2007 08:52:29 -0600