Argghhh! The Home Of Two Of Jonah's Military Guys..: March 25, 2007

by Denizens on Mar 31, 2007 | General Commentary

H&I* Fires, 30 MAR 2007

Open post for those with something to share, updated through the day. New, complete posts come in below this one. Note: If trackbacking, please acknowledge this post in your post. That's only polite.

You're advertising here, we should get an ad at your place...

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Ballistic missile defense news: Japan moves PAC-3 batteries to Tokyo, and here’s a French perspective on what the Poland/Russia brouhaha over US basing of ABMD in Poland is about.

Aussie terrorist pleads guilty.
--ry

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Must read. - FbL

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Fie! CAPT H has dumped me for a higher-traffic site! Tart.

Jules with Good New, Bad News. -the Armorer

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by Denizens on Mar 30, 2007 | General Commentary

Gun Rights decisions, in the courts, implications of.

We mentioned this when it first came out. The Blogfather, Jonah Goldberg of National Review, has a column on it today, that Oldloadr and I thought of interest. You should, of course, read the whole thing.

Considering how badly things have been going for conservatives, right-wingers, Republicans and anyone else whose brain doesn’t explode like one of those guys from the movie Scanners at the thought of another Republican president, it’s worth noting that one of the greatest conservative victories of the last 40 years is quietly unfolding right in front of us. On March 9, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit issued an epochal ruling. The court found that the Second Amendment actually protects the right to bear arms for individuals.

Jonah goes on to observe:

Now, that in and of itself is huge. For decades, the courts, the legal and academic establishments, the press and all right-thinking people everywhere have been arguing that not only is the Second Amendment a chestnut from a bygone age, but that enlightened judges should just go ahead and void the darn thing like a bad parking ticket.

Jonah goes on to chronicle some examples of an unpleasant (to them) truth that some intellectually honest anti-gun liberals are coming to accept - the 2nd Amendment *does* protect an individual right (though I'm sure, deep in their heart of hearts, they hope that if it ever gets to the Supremes, they'll just wave that away).

While Jonah is fine with all that, it's *not* his real point. This is:

Now, you might think this is what I have in mind when I say that the Court of Appeals ruling was an epochal victory for conservatives. But it’s not.
No, the real victory is that liberals are starting to accept the fact that the constitution has a meaning separate and distinct from what the most pliant liberal judge wants it to mean. Therefore, writes Wittes, “perhaps it’s time for gun-control supporters to come to grips with the fact that the (Second Amendment) actually means something ... For which reason, I hereby advance a modest proposal: Let’s repeal the damn thing.” Wittes isn’t alone. A number of left-wing commentators have picked up the idea as well.

Personally, I would oppose repeal, and I have problems with many liberal arguments against the Second Amendment. But that liberals are willing to play by the rules is an enormous, monumental victory that transcends the particulars of the gun-control debate.

[emphasis mine]

Personally, I think that Jonah is too optimistic. But I'd like him to be right. Which, based on some levels of political thought, should be sufficient to make it so, no?

The thought of a cohesive liberal attack on the 2nd amendment itself is creepy. Then again, the whole 'cohesive' part is where I suspect it would fail.

posted by Barb on March 30, 2007 11:21 AM

liberals are willing to play by the rules

Until they decide not to play by the rules. What's the name of those rubber sandals again?

posted by NevadaDailySteve on March 30, 2007 11:42 AM

Repeal the 2nd? Good luck trying. Gun haters would lose a lot of support if they switched from "gun control" to "constitutional gun ban." There are plenty of folks who hate gun violence, but who aren't so hardcore as to think that gun ownership should be denied to everyone. The gun control voting block would splinter into pieces over something like this.

posted by J-P on March 30, 2007 11:56 AM

The task for them (gun-haters) to repeal the 2nd:
2/3 of both houses of congress (they don't have that now and without a profound shift away from current trends i.e. red state versus blue state, they are not going to get that). Even if they did, make it through congress, the next hurdle is 3/4 of the several states’ legislatures have to approve by a 2/3 majority. The founding fathers wanted it to be difficult to change what they had wrought...
BTW, there is no provision for deleting any part of the constitution. Therefore to “repeal” the second amendment would require another amendment which could go all the way or stop short or who knows what when politicians get at something.
J-P’s point is also important. There are many who have had no problem with whittling away at gun freedoms, but who would have doubts (moral, ethical, practical, all of the above) about fiddling with the constitution.

posted by Oldloadr on March 30, 2007 12:13 PM

I agree.

If you wanted to take it to another level you could.

How many people out there would take the "Pry it out of my cold dead hands" slogan seriously?

If they played tiddlywinks with the Constitution to pull it off? I'm betting quite a few. Your describing something that could be revolutionary, or at the minimum ssplintering in affect not just in politics but in legalities and enforcement.

Can you imagine trying to enforce such a decision?

Who are you going to get to do it?
Gun owning Police Officers?
Gun owning National Guardsmen?
Gun owning FBI, or ATF agents?

And even if you could get someone to do it, would you want to be the Agent who knocks on someone's door to tell them "We want your shotgun"?

Shades of Ruby Ridge

posted by BloodSpite on March 30, 2007 1:42 PM

From "pry it out of my cold, dead hands" to "pry it out of my strictly constructed Constitution" :-)

posted by Harvey on April 1, 2007 10:42 AM

by John on Mar 30, 2007 | Gun Rights

A new motivational poster for you...

...from our source at a Higher Military Headquarters™!

Ingenuity.

Ingenuity

The Arsenal will take one on an evaluation basis, please.

by John on Mar 30, 2007 | I think it's funny!

H&I* Fires, 29 MAR 2007

Open post for those with something to share, updated through the day. New, complete posts come in below this one. Note: If trackbacking, please acknowledge this post in your post. That's only polite.

You're advertising here, we should get an ad at your place...

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Boudi's Bro strikes again:

An astronaut crew crash lands on a planet in the distant future where the French are the dominant "species", and other humans are the oppressed and enslaved, and forced to eat nothing but food wrapped in thin pancakes.
I'm calling it, PLANET OF THE CREPES.

Sigh. I probably shouldn't encourage this - but mebbe if he gets good at it and famous, I can be in his posse and pick up scraps. Moving along...

I'm not a McCainiac, but what the heck, Patrick Hynes was polite when he asked...

John McCain has launched a petition on the campaign’s website regarding the actions of the U.S. Senate last night. (Signatories need only give their names). We sure would appreciate a link:
Click here to sign the petition.

· The supplemental appropriations bill that passed the Senate on March 27, calling for a date certain withdrawal from Iraq , is nothing more than a guaranteed date of surrender.

· It is a refusal to acknowledge the dire consequences of failure, in terms of the stability in the Middle East and the resulting impact on the security of all Americans, whether home or abroad.

· Democrats have chosen the politically expedient position of failure rather than putting aside the small politics of the day in the interest of our nation and the values upon which this nation rests.

· We the undersigned remain steadfast in our support for the war against terrorism and mindful of the consequences of failure in Iraq , even if Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid refuse to acknowledge those consequences.

· We support our troops and the new strategy and believe it should be given the opportunity to succeed. American national security interests are directly at stake. Success or failure in Iraq is the transcendent issue for our foreign policy and our national security. People say they want to defeat the terrorists, but if we withdraw from Iraq prematurely, it will be the terrorists' greatest triumph.

· If we leave Iraq based on an artificial timetable, al Qaeda will be free to plan, train for and conduct operations from Iraq just as they did in Afghanistan before 9/11.

Signed, [YOUR NAME]

Act as you see fit!

More politics, this time from the people who are stuffing blogger email boxes with stuff they hope we'll post (I don't post it all, believe me!) comes this "Best One Minute Of The Day" from Congressman Mike Pence of Indiana:

When it comes to the new democrat congress it is the 1970's all over. Hostages in Iran , congress is making plans to withdrawal from another unpopular war and the democrats return to the floor of congress with plans to tax and spend once again. Higher taxes for working families, small businesses and family farms to finance billions of dollars in new spending with absolutely no reform of entitlements, the real threat to our children and grandchildren. The G.O.P. Budget alternative will balance the budget by 2012 without tax increasing, without raiding social security and with truly historic entitlement. I say, madam speaker, say no to reform, bell bottoms, disco and the tax-and-spend politics of the 1970's. Say yes to the republican budget resolution and I yield back.

Click here to view the entire floor speech should you feel the need. Of course, when you do that, you realize from the *packed audience* that most of this speechifying is for the Congressional Record...

Concluding this "All Politics With An Introductory Groaner" edition of the H&I today, let's put in President Bush's speech to an industry group yesterday:

"Our Troops In Iraq Deserve The Full Support Of The Congress"
President Bush: "At The Very Moment That General Petraeus's Strategy Is Beginning To Show Signs Of Success, The Democrats In The House Of Representatives Have Passed An Emergency War Spending Bill That Undercuts Him And The Troops Under His Command." (President George W. Bush, Remarks To The National Cattlemen's Beef Association, Washington, DC, 3/28/07)

1. "First, The House Bill Would Impose Restrictions On Our Commanders In Iraq, As Well As Rigid Conditions And Arbitrary Deadlines On The Iraqi Government." "It would mandate a precipitous withdrawal of American forces, if every one of these conditions is not met by a date certain. Even if they are met, the bill would still require that most American forces begin retreating from Iraq by March 1st of next year, regardless of conditions on the ground."
- "What Is Clear Is That The Consequences Of Imposing Such A Specific And Random Date For Withdrawal Would Be Disastrous." "If the House bill becomes law, our enemies in Iraq would simply have to mark their calendars. They'd spend the months ahead … plotting how to use their new safe havens once we were to leave."

- "It Makes No Sense For Politicians In Washington, D.C. To Be Dictating Arbitrary Time Lines For Our Military Commanders In A War Zone 6,000 Miles Away."

2. "Second, The House Bill Also Undermines The Iraqi Government, And Contradicts The Democrats' Claim That They Simply Want To Help The Iraqis Solve Their Own Problems." "For example, the House bill would cut funding for the Iraqi security forces if Iraqi leaders did not meet arbitrary deadlines. The Democrats cannot have it both ways. They can't say that the Iraqis must do more, and then take away the funds that will help them do so."

- "To Cut Off Support For The Security Forces Would Put Our Own Security At Risk." "Iraq is a young democracy. It is fighting for its survival in a region that is vital to our security. The lesson of September the 11th must not be forgot."

3. "Third, The House Bill Would Add Billions Of Dollars In Domestic Spending That Is Completely Unrelated To The War." "For example, the bill includes $74 million for peanut storage, $25 million for spinach growers. These may be emergencies, they may be problems, but they can be addressed in the normal course of business. They don't need to be added on to a bill that's supporting our troops."

"This Week The Senate Is Considering A Version That Is No Better"

President Bush: "The Senate Bill Sets An Arbitrary Date For Withdrawal." "It also undermines the Iraqi government's ability to take more responsibility for their own country by cutting funds for Iraqi reconstruction and law enforcement. And just like their colleagues in the House, Senate Democrats have loaded their bill with special interest spending."

- "The Consequences Of Withdrawal Would Be Disastrous For The United States Of America." "If we were to step back from Baghdad before it was more secure, before the government could secure its own capital, it would leave a security vacuum. … The terrorists could emerge from chaos … with new safe havens to replace the one they had lost in Afghanistan."

"This Is A Fight That Can Be Won"

President Bush: "Prevailing In Iraq Is Not Going To Be Easy … But This Is A Fight That Can Be Won." "If we cannot muster the resolve to defeat this evil in Iraq, America will have lost its moral purpose in the world, and we will endanger our citizens, because if we leave Iraq before the job is done, the enemy will follow us here. Prevailing in Iraq is not going to be easy. Four years after this war began, the nature of the fight has changed, but this is a fight that can be won."

- "If We Stand By The Iraqi People Today And Help Them Develop Their Young Iraqi-Style Democracy, They're Going To Be Able To Take Responsibility For Their Own Security." "And when that day comes, our forces can come home, and ... we will leave behind a stable country that can serve as an example for others, and be an ally in this global struggle against those who would do us harm."

-the Armorer

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Arts and Crafts, Part Deux: It's official -- the Marines now frown on A&C in combination with bodywork. --BillT

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Tacky. Funny, but tacky. Racist? How do you do that math in this context? Posta-poo. -the Armorer

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Iran just keeps digging

/sigh

I'm not a proponet of the "Let's attack Iran" group (for reasons I won't bring up currently, but it's not because "we shouldn't") , but I'm rapidly seeing us headed that way. The ramifications of which are both good, and depressing.

-BloodSpite
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One of my buds with of ~~cheapa$$ Pictish~~ ~~skinflint haggis-muncher~~ Scottish descent sends me this every. blastid. year. at this time...

When NASA first started sending up astronauts, they quickly discovered that ball-point pens would not work in zero gravity. To combat this problem, NASA scientists spent a decade and $12 million developing a pen that writes in zero gravity, upside-down, on almost any surface including glass, and at temperatures ranging from below freezing to over 300°C.
The Russians used a pencil.

Your taxes are due again--enjoy paying them.

At least he didn't send it *before* I filed... --BillT
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Late to the party, but wanted to add this tid-bit:

My analysis is that the Brits were taken due to the sanctions. Earlier this month, Ahmidinjad had vowed to "hit back hard" if sanctions were voted in. He knew it, we knew it. The blogosphere is going crazy saying the sanctions were "toothless". If they were so toothless, why did the Iranians risk war with their Barbary Pirates impersonation? Only those who do not pay attention to economic reports would call the sanctions "toothless". At this time in Iran's economy, the sanctions have the bite of a 12ft shark on a feeding frenzy at the sea lion waterpark.

We won't have to fire a shot at the Iranians. They are going to implode Soviet Style. Sooner rather than later by the indicaters.
-Kat

The scariest thing you've ever posted:

a planet in the distant future where the French are the dominant "species"

Of course, when I read on to find that other humans had been subjegated by Frenchies, I realized it was a fantasy...

posted by Oldloadr on March 29, 2007 9:06 AM

Remember Armorer,

This is the same group who labeled a 12 year old girl racist because her teacher assigned her to a group of Asians who didn't speak any English.....and she asked her teacher if she could change work groups because she didn't understand anything they said.

And people complain about America.....

posted by BloodSpite on March 29, 2007 9:15 AM

Should have realized it was sci-fi when you read "a planet" -- that would automatically imply they left France voluntarily.

Never include Bretons and Normans with "the French"...

*grinnnn*

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 9:23 AM

Racist? How do you do that math in this context?

Realizing (but -- horrors! -- *not* condoning) the current attitude of most of the citizens of the British Isles these days, the chairman of the English Democrats is prolly thinking the poo will all descend on those most British of bastions -- the madrassas...

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 10:12 AM

In keeping with the Artsy-Crafty thingy --

An astronaut crew crash lands on a planet in the distant future where interior decorators are the dominant "species" and other humans are the oppressed and enslaved, and forced to spend endless hours examining material samples and comparing color swatches. I'm calling it, PLANET OF THE DRAPES.

All. Day. Long.

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 11:00 AM

"An astronaut crew crash lands on a planet in the distant future where vintners are the dominant "species", and other humans are the oppressed and enslaved, and forced to drink nothing but fermented "fruit of the vine".
I'm calling it, PLANET OF THE GRAPES"

posted by NevadaDailySteve on March 29, 2007 12:41 PM

In the words of Dr. Venkman, "Now I have to kill you all..."

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 29, 2007 12:53 PM

I pick Planet of the Grapes, but of course you all prolly figured that...

posted by Oldloadr on March 29, 2007 1:12 PM

that pencil meme irritates me. As would the pencil fragments that would float around in zero-g. You don't want stuff that leaves dust, dirt, grit, bits of graphite and so on after you use it in that kind of environment. Didn't they just have a Floating Wasabi incident in the space station?

posted by bad cat robot on March 29, 2007 1:23 PM

Comrades,

"An astronaut crew crash lands on a planet in the distant future where Richard Nixon clones are the dominant "species", and other humans are the oppressed and enslaved, and forced to listen to constantly looped recordings of his speechs, rants, and blusterings.

I'm calling it, PLANET OF THE TAPES"

Respects,

posted by Gwedd on March 29, 2007 2:04 PM

BillT - Check this out and send to your friend with the "taxing" sense of humor.

posted by Oldloadr on March 29, 2007 2:39 PM

Back off man, I'm a scientist.

posted by ry on March 29, 2007 2:59 PM

Speaking of taxiing -- uhhh -- taxing humor:

"An astronaut crew crash lands on a planet in the distant future where (through some obscene, nauseating and abhorrent twist of evolution) C-130 loadmasters are the dominant "species", and other humans are the oppressed and enslaved, forced to don parachutes, then strapped into Herky-Bird cargo bays and yanked into thin air during fixed-wing nap-of-the-runway exercises.
I'm calling it, Planet of the LAPES"...

Those Who Know, Know.

For all the rest, there's google.

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 3:58 PM

...and they make them sit *sideways* in nasty red-strapped garden chairs (but less comfortable) anchored to the vomit-slicked floor, baking in the heat.

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 29, 2007 4:17 PM

Anyone noticed that Iran and Britain seem to be in a "Whose GPS is better?" match currently?

I found it interesting that you couldn't actually read the coordinates in the Iran interview, however the British showed theirs out right.

Thats not a statement to insinuate their hiding something, just found it interesting.

posted by BloodSpite on March 29, 2007 4:25 PM

Please, they took the Brits the same reason they took them the last time: ransom in the form of financial concessions ie, not enforcing penalties on banks like HSBC for doing business with them, particularly the IRGC. The IRGC captured the Brits. The IRGC owns mega businesses and runs contract services in Iran.

How are the IRGC going to do that if they can't get money in or out of the banks? If they have no credit to draw on to pay their employees and soldiers?

The IRGC is p/o'd, but so are the Mullahs and almond head.

All this talk about "GPS" and borders is BS. The brits have probably run a hundred ops there and never had a problem.

The real tells are Almondhead promising to retaliate if sanctions were passed a few weeks ago. This is the weak mans version of "pre-emptive" war. They needed a bargaining chip to survive. From my point of view, that might not be long at all.

posted by kat-missouri on March 29, 2007 4:35 PM

...and they make them sit *sideways* in nasty red-strapped garden chairs (but less comfortable) anchored to the vomit-slicked floor, baking in the heat.

Oh, the *sob* humanity...

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 4:46 PM

All this talk about "GPS" and borders is BS.

Hey! No need to get personal! :) Kidding aside, I agree.

My only contention with a war with Iran is we are stretched very thin. Scary thin. If the British start the ball rolling I would be extremely surprised if we did not follow suit with them. We have in almost everything short of the Falkland Islands in the last 20 years.

Beyond that, honestly? I'm all for it.

I just can see someone deciding to try to kick our feet out from under us while we're stretched out over 3/4ths of the globe

posted by BloodSpite on March 29, 2007 4:49 PM

I wasn't dissing you. My contention is, we won't need physical war if Iran maintains it's current economic crisis.

Ry thinks I'm off a few decades to their collapse, but I'd say they are cash strapped right now for various reasons. In fact, it is Iran that cannot sustain a war with us.

While they may have some nifty gas reserves somewhere, they only have one gas refinery and no friends who seem like they are going to help them out if that one refinery goes *BOOM*.

They couldn't sustain carp. On top of that, I've been reading of numerous problems keeping military equipment repaired and flying (for isntance). Further, we wouldn't have to go in to Iran. I'd be all for standing off with big ol' airplanes and bombing any infrastructure or government works in to the ground.

Then I'd tell them that anything that moved towards the borders of Afghanistan, Iraq or any place else would be considered hostile, even if it looked like a small band of civilians.

But, in the meantime, I'll settle for a boatload of cheap American goods on the Iranian black market, bought and sold with only American dollars. Crash the Iranian Rial and stand back as the rats try to leave the sinking ship and the rest of ther rats started gnawing on their own.

posted by kat-missouri on March 29, 2007 5:02 PM

Low Altitude Parachute Extinction System

posted by J.M. Heinrichs on March 29, 2007 5:08 PM

Low Altitude Parachute Extinction System

Another fan of the Airdrop Mishaps clip!

Good stuff!

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 5:41 PM

An astronaut crew crash-lands on a planet in the distant future where retired superheroes are the dominant species, and other humans are humiliated just by their consciousness that they'll never be as good at anything as even the old, retired Superfolk.

I call it, Planet of the CAPES!

posted by Justthisguy on March 30, 2007 6:16 AM

ACtually I'm saying that I don't think they'll collapse from within under economic pressure at all--unless it happens real soon-- because there's economic relief on the way in two huge energy markets opening up(PRC and IN) that'll do just about anything to keep their economies firing on all cylinders. Even though they're experimenting with pebble bed nuclear reactors China has a serious energy problem(their coal mines, and they're real reliant on coal, are petering out, so to speak). They're and they will continue to back nasty regimes just to keep the lights on---which in part explains their recent naval build up, sorta.

Yeah, they've(Iran) got problems on the logistics end. Though they've been able to find enough parts on the black market to keep 60% or so of the F-14s flying, but not with the BVR missile capability(though there was some talk and photos of one with an old HAWK missile slung under a 'Cat about 6 months ago, and they were able to do some alterations to an F-5, gave it an F-18 like twin vert stabilizer arangement instead of the giant dorsal fin the Freedom Fighter orginally had). But that's a military thing. That means that they can't bully neighbors since they can't sustain operations. But that hasn't stopped them from producing missiles indigenously, which they're decent at(the ShahabX). And let's not forget how comitted their version of the SS is comitted to guerilla warfare.

And I've been saying for at least 2 years that the 'El Dorado Canyon' option was about all we have with them. It'll hurt. It'll hurt lots. But that could work wonders(the pro-Western kids rise up and topple the IRGC) or backfire(everyone experiences a moment of national solidarity---even though many Persians aren't happy with the Mullahs, and neither are many of te ethnic or religious minorities).

I really think you're under-valuing how bad China wants energy. They're playing in parts of N. Africa where their workers are kidnapped by local terrorists, monthly. Making that gas plant fall down go BOOM gives them one more oppurtunity to capitalize on Western disaffection in building themselves a nice little coalition off of economic development that China's been doing all over the world lately(like Sudan as an example).

I agree that it's over the sanctions. But I also think it's Iran showing that they're the France of the ME by being able to deny anyone else supremacy(France has a history of playing spoiler in COntinental affairs, pre-20th century). I don't think they're going to collapse. Afghanistan and Pakistan have similar economic problems and aren't 'on the verge'.

This is waaaay complicated as there's lots of different 'english' on this ball.

posted by ry on March 30, 2007 7:26 AM

First, as I noted, the Iranians have to come up with enough money to build the pipe lines and factories to take advantage of this Chinese deal. Second, it won't even start to come on line, much less make profit, for another 10 years. I also don't believe the Chinese give a darn about who is in charge of Iran as long as they get the oil. I also believe that the fleet they are building is for hegemony, but I also believe it is more to defend the actual devices (like the oil and gas pipes) and shipping lanes. I believe they would find those more important (knowing that we would not destroy Iran's oil capacity if we can avoid it) they only care that it keeps pumping.

Third, Pakistan and Afghanistan are way different than Iran. To my knowledge, neither of these countries have sanctions against them that prevent investment. Nor are they suffering severe credit issues that prevent them from purchasing basic goods for survival.

Fourth, while the economy is "Islamic" in both Pakistan and Afghanistan, the extent to which the government controls the economy is much different.

For instance, while many Pakistanis are employed by the Pakistan government and they are estimated to have very high unemployment, the figures do not reflect on the economy as much because those "unemployed" are more often than not "employed" in some sort of family trade directly related to the agraculture, animal husbandry or some other traditional employment with a large part of their economy based on traiditonal barter systems.

That's because the Pakistani economy is not as "industrialized" as the Iranian economy.

While a Pakistani's existence may seem "mean" to us and the tribal associations anacronyms to modern society, it has sustained them for centuries and it keeps the tribes independent from the government, thus independent from it's economic woes.

The Iranians, on the otherhand, are much more industrialized. Many more of their people are employed in government operated businesses and industries. In fact, if I could find the article again, WP 3/25, another chief complaint is one of typically industrialized nations: they are losing their agriculture base and damaging another cornerstone of the Islamic Revolution, self sufficiency.

thus, the fate of the people are more closely tied to the official economy of the state. If the state economy fails then the people are set adrift without money or goods and the traditional methods of bartering are lost or broken due to the broken family or tribal connection caused by the migration of industrialization.

Or, more importantly, if the people feel the state economy is failing them then, as our forefathers wrote so precipitously in the Declaration of Independence, governments are not set aside lightly and people will put up with many things, but there comes a time when tyranny (tied with hunger and death) becomes unbearable.

posted by kat-missouri on March 30, 2007 12:36 PM

by Denizens on Mar 29, 2007 | General Commentary

Meanwhile, the war continues.

.S. Army Soldiers examine weapons discovered in an abandoned van in Qubbah, Iraq, March 24, 2007. The Soldiers are from Charlie Troop, 5th Squadron, 73rd Cavalry Regiment (Airborne Recon), 3rd Brigade Combat Team, 82nd Airborne Division out of Fort Bragg, N.C. DoD photo by Staff Sgt. JoAnn S. Makinano, U.S. Air Force. (Released)

U.S. Army Soldiers examine weapons discovered in an abandoned van in Qubbah, Iraq, March 24, 2007. The Soldiers are from Charlie Troop, 5th Squadron, 73rd Cavalry Regiment (Airborne Recon), 3rd Brigade Combat Team, 82nd Airborne Division out of Fort Bragg, N.C. DoD photo by Staff Sgt. JoAnn S. Makinano, U.S. Air Force. (Released)

U.S. Army Soldiers evacuate a wounded Soldier during operations to eliminate insurgents in Qubbah, Iraq, March 24, 2007. The Soldiers are from Charlie Troop, 5th Squadron, 73rd Cavalry Regiment (Airborne Recon), 3rd Brigade Combat Team, 82nd Airborne Division out of Fort Bragg, N.C. DoD photo by Staff Sgt. JoAnn S. Makinano, U.S. Air Force. (Released)

U.S. Army Soldiers evacuate a wounded Soldier during operations to eliminate insurgents in Qubbah, Iraq, March 24, 2007. The Soldiers are from Charlie Troop, 5th Squadron, 73rd Cavalry Regiment (Airborne Recon), 3rd Brigade Combat Team, 82nd Airborne Division out of Fort Bragg, N.C. DoD photo by Staff Sgt. JoAnn S. Makinano, U.S. Air Force. (Released)

by John on Mar 29, 2007 | Global War on Terror (GWOT)

Hanging around in Norfolk for a week...

It's not been "All Wisconsin, all the time" while I'm here.

She's *big* ain't she?

My paper presentation went well, to the, oh, 10 people at the conference who didn't find one of the 13 or so other papers more compelling...

I haven't been exclusively focused on the BigBoat 64, USS Wisconsin - I did visit another pair of famous Americans.

General and Mrs. MacArthur

A nice little museum, if the movie about General MacArthur is, well, interesting. Made by the MacArthur Foundation, it obviously glosses over some elements of the General's career - which is okay, it's a paean, after all. But the sight of the Dauntlesses apparently bombing Pearl Harbor, the Marines landing in the Phillipines (and apparently there were some rogue Marines helping the Japanese on Bataan, too) was a little startling. I was completely unaware that Pearl Harbor was an "own goal" in that sense. I mean, I know all about Roosevelt setting it all up so we'd get in the war and all, but I didn't realize the Navy had bombed itself, too! Nor that Marine flamethrower detachments were helping the Japanese in 1942... But I did get to indulge my small arms jones at both the MacArthur Memorial *and* the Naval Museum of Hampton Roads (in Nauticus, a Navy museum associated with the USS Wisconsin).

Being the Armorer, I did of course find some cannon (recovered from the waterfront during renovations, and carriages thoughtfully provided by the Norfolk Rotary Club).

I took a trip on the Norfolk-Portsmouth Ferry and got to see several naval vessels in various stages of overhaul and repair. An unidentified ~~Aegis cruiser~~ Arleigh Burke-class destroyer getting a pretty thorough working over, the Iwo Jima, and what I think is the USS Cape St. George.

All in all, a good trip. I got to get "re-blued" a bit in my favorite work activity - military modeling and sims-based training (which I get to back to, perhaps, on my next task, yay!) and odd as it sounds, this was my first "trade" convention, so to speak. Too much to do during the day, not enough time to do it all. The vendors were cheap, though. Not enough trinkets!

http://www.monroe.army.mil/Monroe/sites/installation/museum/Casemate_Museum.aspx

As a former Virginian, I would also suggest the Yorktown battlefield as well as Jamestown, which is getting ready to celebrate its 400th anniversary. And of course, you can always join the colonial militia at Williamsburg. At least try to see the governor's mansion there.

posted by Brad on March 29, 2007 8:57 AM

Unless of course, you're already back.

posted by Brad on March 29, 2007 8:59 AM

Nope. But I've been to Yorktown, Jamestown, etc, and don't have time to do Williamsburg (besides, SWWBO'd kill me if I did that by myself without her).

While I wait for flight time to arrive, I may drive across the Cheaspeake.

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 29, 2007 9:02 AM

You can walk around Williamsburg and get inside some buildings if you don't want to pay admission, you might get lucky and see the fife and drum corps.

I think NASA Langley has a very small museum but its been a while, or you might be able to watch them drop test an aircraft or schmooze your way into the hangar there as well. Or just watch the Raptors take off all day from the Air Force side. If you have time you can drive 1.5 hours to Richmond and see the Museum of the Confederacy before they move it to Roanoke and change the name.

posted by Brad on March 29, 2007 9:14 AM

One place I loved to go as a kid when my dad was stationed at NAS Oceania was Hampton Roads museum.

I got my first Monitor & The Merrimac model to assemble there.

A short jaunt up the road is Ft Eustis and the Transportation Corp Museum. (I say short. I'm using my A-typical Georgia Boy Country mileage variation)

I liked living in Virginia many years ago. Lots of history and battlefields. Lived across for Norfolk little town called Pungo off the Bay.

posted by BloodSpite on March 29, 2007 9:21 AM

You can't have too many trinkets... especially the kind *you* like!

posted by Neffi on March 29, 2007 9:21 AM

Trinkets are a *good* thing. Except if you travel with KtLW.

Two years ago, I hadda pay the equivalent of an additional seat in coach just to get her souvenirs back stateside.

My souvenirs fit on a 1 gig chip.

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 9:37 AM

Oh hey, don't forget Ft. Monroe, there is coastal artillery involved!

posted by Brad on March 29, 2007 9:41 AM

I'm entirely on your side on "histerical" films. It drives me up the wall when I see things on the History Channel, or elsewhere, that are just plain factually incorrect.

Unfortunately, the current generation of film producers don't know squat about the military and seem to believe that anything that floats must be a battleship, and if it walks and has a rifle it must be US Army, unless, of course, we want it to be German, or Japanese, or whatever. And I get sick and tired of shots of aircraft that weren't even on the drawing boards yet used to illustrate specific battles.

There is a wonderful story about Ian Fleming getting a letter from a gentleman after his first book was published. The writer took Fleming to task over a number of serious errors concerning weapons in his book. Fleming decided that he would rather not look like an idiot in the future and actually asked the man to proofread his future efforts to ensure accuracy. Fleming then wrote the gentleman into future books as "the Armourer." So, perhaps, you might have yet another career ahead of you.

Marine6 Sends

posted by Marine6 on March 29, 2007 9:54 AM

The Coastie-son has spent a good amount of time at Yorktown. The USCG has a big (for the CG) school there (United States Coast Guard Training Center) where they train boatswainmates coxswains and a lot of other stuff. If you had time they might be persuaded to give a tour. Of course their boats aren't as big as the ones you have taken pics of .. but size doesn't matter does it?

posted by LarryK on March 29, 2007 9:56 AM

I think your U/I Aegis cruiser is a Burke-class desptroyer.

Cheers

posted by J.M. Heinrichs on March 29, 2007 5:13 PM

The DDG-70 is one fine example of a Burke-class destroyer - the USS Hopper. Named for Adm. Grace Hopper.... the mother of computing. A friend of mine was present at a gathering at which Adm Hopper was the keynote speaker. She passed around Nano-seconds for everyone ... a piece of wire cut to the length which light travels in a nanosecond - just under a foot!

posted by Barb on March 30, 2007 12:03 AM

CAPT H, yer right. I'm wrong. It's a new-fangled thing. At least I got the other two right...

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 30, 2007 9:35 AM

Hopper nanosecond = 11.2 inches, according to the one I have, in a box somewhere.

Cheers

posted by J.M. Heinrichs on March 30, 2007 12:14 PM

by John on Mar 29, 2007 | Historical Stuff

H&I* Fires, 28 MAR 2007

Open post for those with something to share, updated through the day. New, complete posts come in below this one. Note: If trackbacking, please acknowledge this post in your post. That's only polite.

You're advertising here, we should get an ad at your place...

*********************************

Heh. Woke up this morning to find my bill slid under the door. Hmmm. Checked the flight sked. Hmmmm. Tomorrow. Well, it *is* warm, but I don't think I wanna sleep on a park bench tonight. Note to self - check the synch matrix.

Longtime reader and email commenter Mike D. recommended this article to me. I commend it to you. Mary Eberstadt writing in the Hoover Institution's Policy Review:

Political particulars aside, the ubiquity of that word “denial” is worth pausing over. It connotes that we live in an era of unreality, perhaps even surreality, in which what is said in public is at odds with what is true — a shortfall invoked now more or less constantly as a feature of political discussion. And so to the obvious question: Why do so many Americans apparently share the sense that we are all being misled, one way and another, about political reality — and not only about reality in Iraq, but about politics more generally?

I believe the answer to that question is the obvious one: because in some deep sense, it is true. This is not meant to affirm that every current charge of “denial” now circulating is a valid one. It's rather to suggest that the sheer volume of such charges reflects a deeper, underlying truth about the untethering of some current political ideas from firm reality. This is the deeper territory that the ubiquity of that term “denial” invites us to plumb.

Moving on - Boudi's Bro submits this - allegedly of his own composition:

What do you call a really good-looking chick wearing an overly-starched blouse?
A chafing dish. [ba-da-dum!]

I'll be here all night. Try the veal.

We can't have veal - that's cruelty! He threatens us with a play if we don't applaud wildly... -the Armorer

*********************************

Ah, the NYTs - living down to low expectations. -the Armorer

*********************************

The case of Phillip Thompson and Senator Webb's pistol gets more interesting... And it doesn't make Webb look very good at all, as he puts on quite a show of fancy footwork. Support for a fellow Marine stops where politics begins, apparently. - FbL

*********************************

Finally some semblance of sanity in this time of madness, lately.

Someone last week made the comment regarding a justified war. Looks like it could go that way if Iran doesn't deal witht he problem.

Prediction: If they go nuclear they'll use just one. Then the next 10 will be delivered Free of Charge.

And how do you know you've been using your "Internet Handle" for way too long?
When game companies start using your name for Roleplaying characters/cards.

I should be honored I guess. Or something. Knew I should have filed that copyright paperwork.

-BloodSpite
**********************************
Since BlSp brought it up.

On the issue of ‘justified war’ someone thinks their smart(http://cernigsnewshog.blogspot.com/2007/03/no-its-not-act-of-war.html) and has declared, unequivocably, that Iran’s actions wrt the RN and RM taken hostage is not an act of war.

I know I’m at best a shop floor lawyer when it comes to the Geneva Conventions and Int’l Law. I know I sound different, kind of full of myself and real self assured on these topics, but that’s only after hashing it out with a professional or three before I open up my yap. I would not be unpleased of someone like ArmyLawyer or EagleSpeak showed this individual the error in their logic---or someone with much better credentials than I.
--ry
**********************************

An update on the story of the dog and handler who triggered an IED in Kandahar last week, in which a wounded sapper wonders if he could have done anything differently. - Damian

**********************************
Another Denizenne birthday!?
And I'm a day late ... again. (I know, I'm fired. Whatever.)
~ Barb (FKA the Adjutant)

**********************************

by Denizens on Mar 28, 2007 | General Commentary

I Am John Doe!

Go over and see Michelle Malkin's latest video. Don't miss a special cameo from one of the Princess' fellow pub crawlers. Read the manifesto.

Related story - Congress did the right thing! Here in Massachusetts, my congressional delegation has one stand up guy......Stevie Lynch. He's from Southie, that explains it.
Princess Crabby

[Update: Over at The World According to Carl - a nice graphic! H/t, Jon the Mechanic- the Armorer]

by Denizens on Mar 28, 2007 | Politics

Since I baffled a former Navy Surface Warfare Officer with this pic...

I think I'll try it out on you guys.

As a Whatziss.

So, Whatziss?

So, tell me - what ship dominates this shot?

Okay! Nope. Try again.

There, your first instinct or google-result has been discarded. Keep working on it.

It's not a ship? Well bugger me you got me good this time.

posted by Trias on March 28, 2007 5:34 AM

A crabber's view of a mobile seaweed plantation. One with a waterline armor belt.

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 5:38 AM

Ok, You said the first guess doesn't count. But it still looks like BB64 - USS Wisconsin.

posted by JimD on March 28, 2007 6:55 AM

Bow on view of a battleship. Scrolling down on your own site indicates there are apartments to the right side of dock area, outside of camera shot, and that you would live there if a broadside view met you each morning. USS Wisconsin.

posted by HH on March 28, 2007 7:12 AM

Proof positive that Maggie will be charging down to the waterfront with her everriculum spread.

*grrrrrrrr-ar-ar-ararar-snap!*

Hey, hey! Down, PG-17c, you idiot! It's a trawl net...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 7:16 AM

Actually, I think it's the stern and John's just being mean to y'all. ;)

posted by ry on March 28, 2007 7:42 AM

By Neddie Jingoes, I think you've got it, ry.

The Wisconsin was famous for being the only BB with 64 painted on the sides of her going-away side.

Riiiiiiight.

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:12 AM

I think it is the Wisconsin, and it is definitely the bow. Compare with this picture.

posted by Barb on March 28, 2007 8:41 AM

Dunno, Brab. The water looks totally different...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:50 AM

USS Kentucky, which was grafted onto the Wisconsin after the collision with a destroyer in the 50's?

posted by Moose on March 28, 2007 8:57 AM

Well it ain't the Hue City although it could be the Kentucky but we'd need to check against the Camden and the Sacramento to be sure with some metallurgical analysis :)

We know for dang sure it's not the Enterprise (one of my Dad's old Ships)

It could have been the Pasadena but she was sold for scrap in 1972.

I toyed with the idea that it might be the USS Hampton (my cousin's old boat. He's part of the deactivation crew for the Rickover now. ) and that I was losing my only-1-cup-of-coffee-fogged mind, but it's definitely not a sub.

Left with no other options I'm stuck saying the Wisconsin as well.

posted by BloodSpite on March 28, 2007 9:16 AM

Could just be the resolution, but it looks like the Tomahawk mast has had its spokes removed.

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 9:31 AM

Yeah, the mast looks kinda bare. But even in this shot, it's hard to see the spokes.

posted by Barb on March 28, 2007 9:52 AM

Comrades,

It's the brow of an Iowa-Class BB. That section you see spead out above her bow once held a pair of quad 40mm AAA mounts.

There's an anchor to port and another to starboard, and that "hole" you see in her bow, topside, is for a tow line to be hauled through.

Respects,

posted by Gwedd on March 28, 2007 10:03 AM

Comrades,

John, are you talking about the Jack Staff on the bow? If so, my question there is why she has a small National Colour hoisted, rather than her Jack?

For those outside the naughtical loop, a Jack is a flag usually made up of only the canton of a Nation's National Colour, and flwon when in port. For the USA, it's a solid blue field with a single white star for each state.

Respects,

posted by Gwedd on March 28, 2007 10:10 AM

Moose! We have a winnah!

It is the brow of the Wisconsin. Except that particular part is a replacement - from the never-completed Kentucky.

When you are forward on the main deck, there is a sign that says... "Welcome to the USS Kentucky."

Interestingly enough - the Kentucky sails on - Kentucky's engines remain in service powering the fast combat support ships USS Sacramento (AOE-1)and USS Camden (AOE-2) (at least as of April 2002).

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 28, 2007 10:45 AM

Hence my bad joke regarding metallurgy;)

posted by BloodSpite on March 28, 2007 11:03 AM

Interestingly enough - the Kentucky sails on...

Nope. Sacramento was decommissioned on 1 Oct 2004 and Camden went exactly one year later.

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 11:11 AM

I was gonna guess the WI, but looks like I've been beaten to the punch.....interesting tidbit about the Kentucky, never would have known that.....they say you learn something new every day.

posted by sandman6actual on March 28, 2007 2:10 PM

Its the pointy end of a BB ya landlubbers

posted by Old Fat Sailor on March 28, 2007 6:32 PM

by John on Mar 28, 2007 | I think it's funny!

Scaring the GFW's...

In yesterday's post about the latest firearm follies on Capitol Hill, the comments veered off into territory sure to make GFW's* queasy and ill-at-ease. Not that we haven't done that before...

Talk about scaring the ~~nor-~~ er, regular folk!

Oh, I noticed that USA Today put that item as a no-context small bit as the next to the last item in column 1 on page 11A. Right next to the "Beware of the Leopard!" sign... At least it was in the A section!

Anyway, NevadaDailySteve brought up the fact that he has a Polish Radom Vis-35 that a family member brought back from WWII.

Which inspired me to link to this Post from the Past. I really *like* my Vis-35.

Which caused Steve to submit Reader Pr0n! Which is good. We like it when readers provide content (No worries Corporal Bristol - I'm working on yours!).

Steve sent this email:

Yours looks to be in better shape. I thought about getting mine re-blued but I've been told that would somehow make it less desirable to C&R collectors. I bought this and the Walther from my father-in-laws estate (he's still alive but in an assisted living center) because I couldn't let them go to someone they didn't mean anything to.
The trigger pull is pretty heavy, I've shot .44 magnums that didn't pull that hard, but it is getting easier the more I shoot it. I don't know if it's because I'm getting used to it or because it's loosening up (Elmer, my father-in-law, never shot it once he brought it back so it never had
a round through it in nearly 60 years.)

Steve's Vis-35.

First off, I commend Steve for keeping them in the family, so to speak. Second, his unknown advisor is correct - don't reblue a historical piece. Just take care of it. This one, as a wartime bringback, has greater value than all the pretty arsenal reworks like the one I own - it has no import marks. And for real collectors, who know the ebb and flow of arms imports into this country will know that even without provenance, a Vis-35 that has no import mark is most likely a wartime bringback, because mass importations out of Poland didn't happen until *after* all incoming arms were required to have an importer stamp.

BTW - don't buff off the stamp on your weapons - it would make them illegal.

by John on Mar 28, 2007 | Gun Pr0n - A Naughty Expose' of the fiddly bits

Maybe It's Just Me

The Army launches the Wounded Soldier and Family Hotline -- which is a Good ~~Thing~~ Start, considering it's not monitored during the weekends (*psssst* -- hey, guys? Problems don't knock off for the weekend at 1900 on Friday. Just sayin')...

The VA launches TF Heroes -- which has the potential to be a Very Good Thing as long as the Organization doesn't turn it into a bureaucratic La Brea...

The Navy launches a new DDG to play its part in keeping Hugo R. Chávez awake of a night...

And the Air Force launches...

*sigh*

...the Air Force launches...

*sigh*

...an Arts and Crafts website.

Like I said, maybe it's just me...

Trolling for Dusty? ;)

posted by FbL on March 28, 2007 12:55 AM

BWA-HA-HA-HA-HA-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!

Hee hee hee hee hee hee hee...

*wipes eyes*

Ah, *that's* what I needed before heading off to present the paper. A little whiff of grape sent whistling down the flight line, from the rotary apron down amongst the fixed wings.

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 28, 2007 4:26 AM

Fold your own air cover?

posted by Murray on March 28, 2007 4:53 AM

I could have frosted this particular cake with the announcement that the CoS of the Air Force has also launched a site intended for the edification of the Enlisted Folks -- it lists weekly topics of concern that the *Ossifers* are pondering.

But that would have distracted all the Autopilot Babysitters from their macramé projects...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 5:54 AM

The Untied States Army...still jealous after all these years...

Instapilot

P.S. I will say this: Did you see the message from the CSAF about the budget? Something to the effect that "We're warriors too and need our fair share!"?

Feh.

posted by Instapilot on March 28, 2007 6:49 AM

Instapilot - About time you showed up! This target-rich environment was getting tedious...

Plus, since you is an Ossifer, I knew you would have a more witty come-back then I could muster.

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 7:02 AM

Plus, since you is an Ossifer, I knew you would have a more witty come-back then I could muster.

So, why didn't he use it?

*sauntering off humming, "Up in the Air, Junior Birrrrdmennnnnn"...*

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 7:23 AM

I thought he did; must have been too subtle for some folks...

We know you all have jealous sibling syndrome...

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 7:44 AM

Yes, but Arts and Crafts expand your mind... get you to think creatively!

*snerk*

my poor zoomies....

posted by AFSister on March 28, 2007 8:14 AM

Durn. I *knew* I should'a got my Nuance E booster shot when I went down to Wally World for my annual rabies series...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:17 AM

...Arts and Crafts expand your mind...

...as will being dropped headfirst onto a rock.

Heh. Having an expanded *mind* isn't the reason most of the AF types I know hit the gym on their lunch hour...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:22 AM

Besides, you never know when being able to tie a perfect macramé knot could save your life in a tactical situation.

On top of that, the arts and crafts shops are why our love-me walls look better than your love-me walls.

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 8:24 AM

Besides, you never know when being able to tie a perfect macramé knot could save your life in a tactical situation.

Dunno. I've never been in a situation that called for subduing an enemy florist...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:32 AM

...our love-me walls look better than your love-me walls.

*sniffle*

Only wall I ever loved was the one made of 55-gallon drums filled with sand that I snuggled up against when that ARVN 105 battery shelled us.

It doesn't *write*, it doesn't *call*...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:41 AM

BillT - You just aren't thinking outside the box...

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 8:42 AM

I can't think outside the box. The sun is still up...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 8:46 AM

BillT - You're just not thinking outside the box...

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 9:02 AM

Dunno how that happened...

Anyway, we still have cooler love-me walls...

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 9:04 AM

Anyway, we still have cooler love-me walls...

Silly me -- I'd always thought of pink as a *warm* color.

Oooop! The Official USAF Arts 'n' Crafts Digital Color Wheel sez it's actually Dusty Rose, which is *thumb-twirl* either a warm color with cool undertones or a cool color with warm overtones. Must need a new battery.

Ummmm -- it was a freebie. The lady at the register gave it to me when I bought 500' of Flightline Brand Macramé Cord...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 9:11 AM

Whoa! Party! That was Oldloader's first trigger of the Great Hall Echo!

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 9:15 AM

Mine (love-me wall) is on dark wood paneling, thank you very much.

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 9:40 AM

Dark wood paneling is sooooo last season.

See? Sez so right here on page 137 of Volume VII of the Official USAF Arts 'n' Crafts Interior Decorating Encyclopedia (Bomber Pilots' Edition).

Quick, somebody get me some zebrawood sheeting so I can make a box to think outside of with.

(Nothing in the Castle Style Book against ending a sentence with *two* prepositions...)

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 9:50 AM

Does it have a class for Underwater Basket Weaving?

posted by BloodSpite on March 28, 2007 9:50 AM

Nope. You might want to try your hand at Southwestern Sand Sculpture, though...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 9:54 AM

You've been having more fun than I have...

At least we know Dusty is still alive and kicking...

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 28, 2007 10:49 AM

I was just thinking that "Dusty Rose" would be a kicker of a title for his bio...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 11:14 AM

I was just thinking that "Dusty Rose" would be a kicker of a title for his bio...

Wasn't Dusty Rose a wrestler back in the day?

posted by NevadaDailySteve on March 28, 2007 11:39 AM

Sorry for that first post, I couldn't resist. I'll go back to looking at the art. Actually I found one painting that I really liked:

Go figure. Living near the geographical center of the continental US I've always been fascinated by the sea.

posted by NevadaDailySteve on March 28, 2007 11:47 AM

Dusty may be alive, but he ain't doing too much kicking, leaving me surronded by all you grunts like this.

*Chaff/Flare -- Chaff/Flare*

buggin' out

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 11:48 AM

Let me try that link again
http://www.airforcegallery.com/popup/TheSea_Roche.html

Here

posted by NevadaDailySteve on March 28, 2007 11:53 AM

"*Chaff/Flare -- Chaff/Flare*"
... and he rode wildly away in all directions ...

Cheers

posted by J.M. Heinrichs on March 28, 2007 12:21 PM

Heh. Oldloadr, it just became a Combined Op on your lonely empennage.

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 28, 2007 12:37 PM

Target in sight, aircraft in launch constraints.

TOW on the wire...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 12:41 PM

Don't underestimate the value of the macramé plant hanger in modern warfare.

It can be pretty deadly.

Or just sooooo pretty eh flyboy?

posted by Murray on March 28, 2007 1:36 PM

We find you all...amuzing.

In case you're wondering why I'm not posting, well, it's been a distracting coupla weeks.
1) The upstairs of the haus is being remodeled...for about the cost of a fully tricked-out Apache. Or at least that's what it feels like.
2) I'm starting to review the approximately 25 pounds of flight manuals for the MD-11 that I have to be "familiar with" prior to starting class in about 3 weeks.
3) Wife's birthday was yestiddy. Recovered nicely with diamond earrings. (f*@k it...she earned 'em and who needs a nest egg anyway?)
4) Watching the political scene and am being torn between throwing my hands in the air and going completely postal at the Congress. Being much more Khan-like than John or Bill, I think I just better keep my mouth shut and go bond with the characters in "300" over a tub of popcorn and a diet Coke.

posted by Instapilot on March 28, 2007 1:43 PM

I forget which movie it is (I'm leaning towards Remo Williams) but I keep thinking of the scene where the guy learns some killer martial art move because he spends all day trimming bonsai tree's.

Must be the new AF Pilot survival course.

Heh.

posted by BloodSpite on March 28, 2007 1:46 PM

It's definatley time to take my high ASVAB scores back to the barn (if I don't run out of chaff)...

posted by Oldloadr on March 28, 2007 1:46 PM

Oh, sure, typical aviator excuses... pardon me I have to do some reading so I don't plant a yard dart in your roof... the flight pay just doesn't stretch as far as it used to... I need some crew rest... the wife's birthday...

Okay, the last one counts.

;^)

posted by John of Argghhh! on March 28, 2007 5:41 PM

Dusty ROADS was the wrestler.

I almost feel the need to defend the air force guys except my bro has a big "love me" wall, too. On white.

He has generously included memorabilia from other military family members.

And he has told me stories about AF manuals and guidelines that go something like this:

Insert screw at 90* angle
Place head of screw driver on top of screw
Turn screwdriver clockwise until screw is flat with surface
Tighten screw to 450lbs torque

Obtain torque measuring tool
Measure torque of tightened screw
Adjust until desired torque is reached

Technician sign off check sheet
Tech Sgt/supervisor sign off check sheet
Lt sign off check sheet
Capt sign off check sheet
Col sign off check sheet
General/base commander sign of check sheet

Send copy of check sheet in triplicate to all parties involved.
Place three copies of check sheet in maintenance folder
Place three copies of check sheet in hangar folder
Send copy of check sheet to IG
Send another copy because first copy is lost

Ground air plane because paperwork incomplete
Get new check sheet signed by all of the above because the technician forgot to initial section 2.2.4A My mother checked the torque

Repeat process until IG does QA check and discovers that the screw only has 48 threads instead of 50

Get written up for using wrong materials.
complete 100 page report explaining that the Supply Depot only orders 48 thread screws because that is the only screw available on approved Pentagon vendor supply list for that specific equipment.
Write 100 page report verifying that the equipment manufacturer guidelines clearly indicate that only a 48 thread screw should be used when repairing that piece on that equipment.
Write 100 page report verifying cost effectiveness of ordering and using correct screw.
Supply dept writes 200 page report requesting Pentagon add manufacturer to approved vendor list.
DoD sends back report asking for picture of screw and technical details.
Send 50 pages of technical details for 48 thread screw.
DoD rejects request on the grounds that the Air Force Manual specifically states that a 50 thread screw should be used to repair equipment.

Equipment needs to be repaired so you go the Supply Dept to find out if 48 thread screws have been approved.

Discover that, not only has it not been approved, but the Supply clerk threw out the rest of the 48 thread screws because the DoD response said anyone knowingly using inappropriate tools and supplies for repair will receive an article 15.

Go to immediate supervisor and explain problem.
Supervisor sends you to home depot to obtain appropriate screws.
Repair equipment following all instructions.
Complete all check sheets.
IG/QA returns to discover that you have used yet another 48 thread screw when it clearly states in the AF manual that it is 50.

show IG/Qa manufacturer specs. Provide visual demonstration that 50 thread screw will not fit flush on equipment and could be sheared off by moving parts of jet engine, sucked into the jet engine causing catastrophic failure and potential death to the pilot.

IG/QA reports you to your supervisor as a malcontent that requires additional training because you refuse to follow AF manual guidelines.

Supervisor acts shocked that you would go to Home Depot and purchase non-DoD authorized supplies from a non-DoD approved vendor

Supervisor writes you up.

Begin appeal process again with 100 page report on why the Air Force is full of idiots. LOL

posted by kat-missouri on March 28, 2007 5:45 PM

kat - I've got a tale about the Directorate of Evaluation and Standardization that sounds a lot like that. Has to do with the color ink used to sign off on training records...

posted by BillT on March 28, 2007 10:25 PM

MD-11? Is that the one that used to be the DC-9, is now the Boeing 7X7, or something?

I thought you were driving a three-holer.

posted by Justthisguy on March 28, 2007 11:25 PM

If the air force is "full" of idiots why are they still recruiting?

posted by Murray on March 29, 2007 1:19 AM

If the air force is "full" of idiots why are they still recruiting?

Rapid turnover.

They're used to test equipment the manufacturer claims is idiotproof; the ones who successfully misapply the item get promoted and transferred to procurement.

posted by BillT on March 29, 2007 5:54 AM