previous post next post  

The Whatziss of a different color, answered.

By The Armorer on January 15, 2007 | | Comments (12)

Czech Legion artillery firing during the battle of Zborov.

If the title of this post makes no sense - start here.

You guys did pretty well. Chief Shaffer correctly id'd the Whatziss as a Colt M1895 "Potato-Digger" machine gun. He provided this link, too.

Sanger came in and offered up the Czech Legion, again correct. While he offered up a pay train - he was close, if obliquely. This was one of the trains that held some of the Russian gold reserves the Czechs found themselves in possession of... Good work, fellas.

The Czech Legion is an interesting story that I didn't know that much about. Rather than regurgitate it all here, I'll just give you this link to the Wikipedia entry and this link to The Czech Legion Project, which has a lot of photos.

Another thing I found interesting about the picture was the fact that all of the Maxim guns are Russian M1905's with the smooth waterjacket, vice the M1910's which had a corrugated jacket (and is the type of Maxim in the Castle Armory). But where I can tell, they are all on the later, type II style Sokolov wheeled mounts with shields, which were made without the extra legs seen in the photo below.

Hosting provided by FotoTime

The M1905 is the gun in the rear. The legs of the Sokolov mount are extended. The M1910 is in front, with the legs folded for movement.

Share This Article:

Categories:

12 Comments

By Beth on January 15, 2007 1:47 PM
oh, cool - we have a Sokolov mount. For Maxim!
 
By MajMike on January 15, 2007 2:11 PM
very cool post. a forgotten moment of warfare, captured in time and revealed by your post. thanks for that!
 
By SangerM on January 15, 2007 4:55 PM
Wow! ^^^^^^^^^^^ buttons ^^^^^^^^^^^^ The Czechs really do have a pround history, w/ a lot to brag about, including one of the oldest universities in Europe, the oldest Jewish Cemetary in Europe, a bridge built with egg-yolks for cement (Karlovy Most, Charles' Bridge), and etc. The country was free from 1918 until Hitler was given it, and had an interesting time. The first President was Tomas Masaryk, who declared Czechoslovakia's independance from the steps of Independence Hall. The Czech flag is Red, White and Blue because our's is. Czechoslovakia was one of the few Warsaw pact countries that had a citizenship treaty with the US (Czechs who became Aericans were no longer deemed Czechs and could travel there without fear of being conscripted.) Lot of other stuff. I was not aware of all the Czech Legion stuff until I started looking for the photos, but I'd heard about them--about the same time I learned about the extent of American involvement (a land Army!!) in Siberia at the end of WWI... Now THAT is an interesting read! V/R
 
By SangerM on January 15, 2007 7:41 PM
The arty pieces look like WWI Russian (75?), similar to these, but I can't make out much detail... The Officer behind the far left gun (in the saucer cap) looks Russian. The second gun from the left looks broken (in full battery). Siberia?
   
By ry on January 15, 2007 10:26 PM
So, the ribbing on the waterjacket was to increase surface area for convection then?
 
By SangerM on January 15, 2007 10:34 PM
Battle of Zborov. Note sure if that's the answer to the arty picture or more Czech stuff, but it made me think some more about the Czechs. 1) Frank Zappa was a national idol, credited with being a primary inspiration behind the Velvet Revolution ... No kidding, I knew many Czechs who knew the lyrics to lots of Zappa's songs, and were always surprised to find we Americans didn't all love him too. This is an article about "The Plastic People of the Universe.".. "In January of 1990, just as the new democracy had begun, Frank Zappa flew to Prague at the invitation of Havel, one of his greatest fans. 5000 rock fans were waiting at the airport to witness the historic arrival of the famous American. A Prague film crew captured Zappa's arrival at the airport just as Shirley Temple Black, the former "good ship lollipop" girl, then the acting ambassador to Czech , was leaving. Mrs. Black was asked about her views on the distinguished Frank Zappa's visit. Czech citizens did not understand her horrified reaction to this question. Zappa met Havel at Prague Castle and presented the new president with several ideas on how to help Czechoslovakia move into the democratic age, such as cellular phones and tourism. Zappa was emotionally overcome upon meeting older fans of his who had endured beatings by the Secret Police for the sake of his music." Link I knew people who felt that way about him. It was very odd... 2) The term ROBOT was coined by a Czech writer named Karel C'apek (Chapek) in a 1920 play titled R.U.R. (Rossums Universal Robots). He also wrote War with the Newts a classic of Science Fiction. 3) Saint Wenceslas is the patron saint of the Czechs. Yes, that Good King Wenceslas, of "Feast of Steven" fame. Duke of Bohemia (907-935). There's lots more, but that's what I remember. Oh, and every time I asked a Czech why they didn't fight back in 1968, the answer was always, "we survived." I guess they did.
 
By John of Argghhh! on January 16, 2007 5:42 AM
Ry, the most common reason given for the fluting is strength. The water boiled, regardless, and the steam was taken off by the hose to the water can, where it condensed, the end of the hose being submerged in water in the can. The jacket was refilled from the can. Interestingly, the Germans never fluted their Maxims, the Brits started with fluting, and went to smooth (and a heavier jacket to make up for the strength loss, which was really popular with the troops... not) to save time and complexity in manufacture. The Russians started out smooth, and went to fluted. During WWII they developed the "snow cap" which was a much larger hole in the top of the jacket so the troops could pack the jacket with snow. Sanger - the Battle of Zborov in the Ukraine is a Czech Legion battle, and those guns are Legion guns - according to the picture source.
 
By ry on January 17, 2007 2:39 AM
"Ry, the most common reason given for the fluting is strength." I would've thought that the simple smooth jacket had more strength. Bending metal does things to the metal. And odd surface shapes, may, cause odd force vectors. I'm surprised that it's the other way. Is there a short answer for why the flutting was stronger?
 
By XCavTrooper on January 17, 2007 8:35 PM
Ry, Take a look at the following - it focuses on barrel fluting which doesn't really apply because the jackets are closer to corrugated metal than a mostly-solid barrel, but see the "Ridged Roof Analogy" subsection which discusses how thin metal is bent to add strength. http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/RealBenefitsBarrelFluting.asp The takeaway I had from the article (bear in mind I'm not a structural engineer and I would definitely check my comprehension) is basically that the metal strength is a quality of its thickness and the ridges turn the load-bearing aspect from the thickness of the material to the thickness/depth of the ridges - the same function as an I-beam where the strength is more related to the web between the top and bottom of the "I" and not the thickness of the steel making up the top and bottom.
 
By ry on January 18, 2007 7:12 AM
Thanks XCav.
 
By John of Argghhh! on January 18, 2007 7:18 AM
The same reason aircraft like the Ford Tri-Motor and Junkers 52 used corrugated skin, stronger, yet lighter overall. One of the reasons you'll see holes in structural members is actually to provide points of stress relief, which makes them stronger without the weight.